After the sociopath: How do we heal? Part 16 – The end of recovery
PDF Because there is so much discussion lately about pity, empathy and compassion in the wake of a relationship with a sociopath, I am writing this article to discuss compassion as it fits into the recovery process.
Before I begin, I would like to humbly remind my readers that recovery, by its nature, is a progression through different stages of emotional learning. If the trauma is major, these emotional states will be intense. And they will color our “sight” or view of the world and ourselves. I’m pointing this out as a warning that, unless you are in late-stage recovery, the material in this article may be irritating and you may find me a holier-than-thou pain in the butt.
If the farthest you have gone in trauma processing is denial, bargaining, anger, or grief and letting go, the related emotions will – and should – dominate your view of things until you learn the lessons of that stage and gaduate to the next one. Each graduation changes your world, and it also alters your perspective on how you felt before. For example, anger looks back at denial as a less empowered, less insightful phase. And denial veiws anger as anger as socially unacceptable or scary. This is just the natural progression of maturing consciousness. We look back from a larger perspesctive. We tend to block or demonize information from levels that are too far beyond where we are now.
So if this article doesn’t make sense to you, or it seems “nice but improbable,” or you find it irritating or nutty, it means it’s not useful to your current learning stage. Typically we can see into the next level of healing, even if we’re not fully there. Beyond that, it’s hard for us to intuitively grasp how it’s going to be.
As we observe on LoveFraud, there is a lot of learning in recovery. This article is about the end of the process. It’s an end so complete that, every “next time” we face a trauma, we know how the processing will end. It changes forever the way we approach healing and the speed at which we do it.
Defining compassion
Most of us grew up in the Judeo-Christian tradition where compassion is understood as a “social” feeling. That is, the feeling is about “we,” not just “I.” It’s associated with ideas about welfare as a community goal, not just an individual one. So we tend to define compassion as concern about someone else’s difficulty plus some level of obligation to help.
This definition of compassion is why the sociopath’s pity ploy is so challenging for us. It’s also why there may be resistance to my statements that I feel compassion for my ex, because I am aware of the painful identity damage he lives with. The assumption, I believe, is that it’s dangerous to feel compassion for an anti-social person, because that feeling comes with implied obligation to help. So it may seem inexplicable that I am aware of his pain, but feel no responsibility for alleviating it.
The concept of compassion that I am presenting to you today is somewhat different. It is more like a Buddhist or Eastern idea of compassion. This compassion is simply a state (of mind), not a process of identifying need and acting on it. This state of compassion may inform our actions — quite literally inform, by providing information – but the actions themselves are driven by other commitments or goals.
That’s all very abstract. Why does it matter?
Here’s why. The state of compassion — which is open-hearted willingness to understand other people’s states and situations and to feel whatever feelings that produces — puts us into full alignment with “what is.” It’s a vibrant awareness that keeps us gathering information, learning, and accepting reality without judgment.
It’s not that we don’t make judgments on other levels of consciousness. In a compassionate state, we may understand what’s driving a person who is dangerous to us. On another level, we may interpret this person as nothing but a threat and be preparing to defend ourselves or flee. But the compassionate level “sees” their state, our state, and many surrounding details. All that information moves “down” the processing ladder to refine what’s going on at the visceral self-defense level, the pleasure-pain level, our community-feelings level, and the cognitive level where we’re doing logical reasoning.
In other words, this compassionate level of awareness feeds all our processes by providing them with information that is detailed, perceptive and based on openness to active states and connections in our environment.
If this sounds like a hierarchy of consciousness, that is exactly what it is. There are lots of models for this hierarchy, which I’m not going to get into now. But I mentioned earlier that this is the end-state of recovery. That means recovery from a specific trauma. It doesn’t mean that we have this compassionate awareness in every area of our lives, but any specific healing process is over when we have processed through to compassion.
Our changing focus in healing
We’ve talked about denial, bargaining, anger, grief and letting go, and finally learning the lesson that changes our perspectives and/or life rules. This follows the Kubler-Ross model of grief processing. But Kubler-Ross was conceived as a model for people facing terminal illness. It described how people come to accept the ending of their lives. The model I’m working with goes farther, because it assumes that recovery is a doorway into a new chapter of life.
To see the whole picture of recovery, it helps to look at the progressive shifts in our focus. Up to anger, and including part of the angry phase, trauma processing is about maintaining personal control — the idea that this is something we can change or affect. First we try to control our reactions (denial), then we try to control how our behavior influenced the situation (bargaining), then we try to control the situation by force of will (anger). In anger, we grasp that the problem is external to us. To control the impact of such externalities in the future, we develop defensive skills and perceptions.
In the later stages of anger — and this is one of the things that moves us out of anger — we become aware that we’re dealing with something that was not in our control at all. While the skills-building makes us feel better about ourselves, we are still reacting to outside threats. This focus on the external continues through the grieving and letting go process.
Turning inward
Grieving what we cannot change leads, eventually, to letting go. We can’t fully let go in anger. Instead, we have to revisit the love or great value we felt toward what we lost. (This may be, and often is, something that we now recognize as an illusion.) Reawakening love, even to say goodbye, relaxes us back into ourselves, and opens us to the “lightbulb” learnings that typically release us from previous attachments or ideas of what we “must” have or do to be happy or whole.
In discovering what we don’t need, we gain freedom – more scope of action, feelings, and even intellect. But to explore the meaning of that freedom, we find ourselves “shaking down” our internal systems to see what makes sense now and what doesn’t. With freedom comes responsibilities, and we have more learning to do about how we will act, what we will expect, and how our feelings work in this new world.
As a simple example, a common learning from our experience with a sociopath is that, although we once needed other poeple to confirm our okay-ness, we realize we don’t need external validation to trust our values and perceptions. So flattery and promises, or outside opinons about our dreams or our guilt, may sometimes make us feel good (or bad) but they’re not ultimately as true for us as our own ideas and feelings. So how does that affect every other relationship in our lives? Working this through takes time and experimentation.
More to the point, perhaps, relationships with sociopaths teach us that we have the inborn entitlement and responsibility to take better care of ourselves. To take ourselves more seriously. To assign higher value to not just our survival, but what we do with our lives. And this imperative eventually brings us to a confrontation with how we really feel about ourselves.
Clearing the obstacles to self-love
This confrontation is usually shocking, something like traumatic. It’s mindbending to discover that we’ve been carrying around damage that has caused us to treat ourselves as badly as we accused the sociopath of doing. In fact, we could almost call the sociopath an agent of our own distrust and disrespect for ourselves.
But now we’re experienced enough to know that we didn’t do this to ourselves. We identify the externaliites and note how little control we had. Even working with memories, we can assert our right to our integrity, our right to thrive, and reject the old influences on our lives that once crippled us with feelings of unlovability, unworthiness, insecurity or despair.
This process of restoring self-love is the end stretch of trauma-processing. Our shakedown of our internal beliefs, rules and processes becomes more pervasive and profound. We are in touch with a need that we may have felt before, often masked in background anxiety or in addictive hungers, but we can’t mistake what it really is. We want to clear away anything that keeps us from being in touch with our true self — the bright, good, authentic, perceptive, learning, feeling center that has been the source of our best social impulses and also our self-healing impulses all our lives.
When we understand that this center exists and feel its nature, we come home to something that has always been there. It’s an experience that is impossible to describe, but it is the beginning of making sense of everything in our lives. In particular, we see how much of our life story has been about our attempts to heal traumas and get back to who we are. We become more conscious of how unhealed wounds color our perceptions. Though we cannot resolve everything at once, each resolved trauma illumates more of our authentic self, and helps us tell the differnce between what is authentic in us and what is unfinished trauma-processing. In this knowledge, we become more understanding and able to comfort ourselves, and more accepting of our normal human pains, fears, losses, as well as hungers, attractions, and goals.
We don’t have to be perfect to love ourselves. We can make peace with who we are. We can become more relaxed about new challenges, because we accept that, win or lose, we’re going to learn something great. We can acquire a sense of humor about where we’re still developing and are not so good at being all we could be.
We gain a new perspective, a kind of distance from ourselves that relieves us from fear and criticism, but encourages us in our progess as evolving people. That perspective also gradually aligns all the levels of consciousness behind a new “boss,” a new highest, deepest level that is more open and smart, while being more tolerant and supportive of our humanity. All of it — our need to physically survive, our genetic attachments to family, our drive to bond and reproduce, our dependence on community, our desire to make our lives meaningful, and all the other needs that come with being human. Compassion is like having an angel in the “top office,” influencing the way the whole company works.
But here’s the thing about compassion. As that open-hearted awareness anchors our internal workings, it also changes the way we see the world. Our perceptions are a reflection of our inner lives. We see from where we are in ourselves.
Compassion and Sociopathy
Compassion is a state of awareness. As I said earlier, this definition of compassion does not require us to act or react. It simply provides a new and more refined set of information to the rest of our systems. In the case of identifying a sociopath or finding reason to react, the identification is made with openness to understanding their state, including the wounded pain of their broken humanity. But compassion feels this pain without becoming involved in it. The information made available to our defensive systems may be simply that this person is wounded, extremely needy for personal support, but is apparently unable to heal or return support to other people. His needs are bottomless and not fixable by us.
Sad for him, and sad for us to know this about him. But it clarifies our response. Compassion tells us there is no potential for a mutual relationship and nothing to be gained by trying to help.
People who have read me here for a while, know that I am committed to changing social systems that, in my belief, create the circumstances in which children develop affective disorders – inadequate nurture, environmental violence and direct abuse. Sociopathy is an affective disorder, which may have genetic factors of predisposition, but is powerfully affected by environmental factors. I can’t change sociopaths, but I want to help reduce future suffering (and all the suffering it causes) at the source, where children are learning despair of trusting anything but themselves.
My way to change those systems is to help individuals stop the cycle of damage for themselves. I believe that we can heal our old damage, so we are no longer perpetuating or supporting the transmission of damage through generations, communities and other human systems. If we don’t get well, we are part of the problem. If we do get well, we become living solutions. Some of us will change the world just by being human beacons, people who inspire other people to learn to love themselves and discover with the powerful rationality that compassion brings. Some of us will use the information compassion brings us to actively work on human systems to create a better world where human potential can flourish.
So that is compassion in my view. I hope this clarifies what I mean when I talk about compassion, and why some of you may find my perspectives and my language so different. I hope that, in my voice, some of you hear the voice of your future.
Namaste. My angel high-fives your angel.
Kathy
PS. This article is not about what’s wrong with you, being a more loving person so you’re treated better, or accepting or forgiving bad behavior. If it even seems like that, come back and take another look at it in a year or so. In the meantime, don’t worry, you’re doing fine and exactly where you’re supposed to be on the path.
written by Kathleen Hawk • Permalink •
witsend says:
hens,
Two years. Good for you. You should have a Party! A celebration…Lol. A hens-fest.
Life does go on doesn’t it? I need to get a life. It really is a shame that we all are spead all over the place and can’t be RL friends for each other. We could have one heck of a 2 year celebration at your place, or mine if we all lived closer.
I love to cook and would host your hens fest if you wanted.
We could vote for a golden skillet award and Oxy could present it to the winner. Now who would we vote for….so many contendors and only one grand prize?
(Report abusive comment)
Rosa says:
FYI:
I believe the following screen names are still available for any possible takers
Prego Girl
Power Skillet
Donut Maker
Eternal Virgin
23-year-old Virgin
Forever 29
Single & Loving It
Single & Hating It
Bizzle-Free (bizzle is my new nickname for a cluster B)
Zen in 2010 (my personal fave for the new year)
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
You forgot GODIVA
(Report abusive comment)
hens says:
or Born Again Virgin
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Snakeinwaiting
(Report abusive comment)
hens says:
Twisted Sister
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Puppetmaster
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Yea, I can change mine to “Twisted Sister” which is what Hens calls me, or Skillet Swinger, but I think I will just stay with my old one of Ox Drover, cause though Oxen are generally very gentle critters it is kind of a power trip to command such strength at your beck and call.
Glad you guys are having a good time and joking away, it’s good to just be silly sometimes, and God knows we NEED a good laugh. I still can’t get to my regular e mail from down here in the Lone Star State but am able to log on to LF so I am not going completely bonkers for a “fix” from my friends!
I went and got my hair styled by an “upscale” Dallas hair dresser and it looks really COOL, gang, now if I could just talk myself into one of those “lifestyle one-hour face lifts” that make the 70 year old women look 25, I’d be all set—that and a few pounds of liposuction and I’d be a “hot babe” again! LOL ROTFLMAO
(Report abusive comment)
hens says:
Erin Did you hear about the puppet that went to the doctor and asked the doc ‘whats wrong with me?’ Doc says ” you have a hand up your ass~!”
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Hens:
HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA….your so cute!
Oxy’s got BOUNCY hair……look out boys, here comes oxy with the moxy!
(Report abusive comment)
recovering says:
To hens (formerly known as Prince…er…Henry) — I love the new moniker. maybe ErinBrock can rename me since “recovering” needs to have an end point, so I can get on with life…unless the point is that I’m recovering from life.
Send me back to the womb, then. LOL
Seriously, just joking folks. It’s Saturday night, and I don’t have a date. LOL.
(Report abusive comment)
autisticsouls says:
Kathy, we be watching a movie today that just come to DVD recent called “Adam” about an Asperger man named Adam making his way into the everyday world after his father died.
group home still an option in mine mind. But husband can’t go back to others making decisions for himself after fighting so hard for the right to make his own. took too long to become capable he says. he been proud to do things like be able to vote. we been much delayed. mineself not spoke a word until aged 9 and labeled mentally retarded until aged 12. those were some simple years. no expectations, no pressures. mine best friend had Down Syndrome and was very functioning in many areas. we been a good team back then. she spoke early at aged 4 and responded well to others and took instructions well, she naught shut down like i would do. she did things i couldn’t do. but some tests i took revealed that i was smarter than i behaved. no one taught me to read and mathematics. such lovely poetry that be. concise and clear in it’s dependability. mathematics. such harmony.
but this be so what turned mine world about, mine ability to pick things up easily even from limited environments. those stupid tests.
Bevs test results didn’t come off so good even if she be able to do things i could not, like give eye contact, speak in more than three words (and appropriately), and dressed herself, even tie her shoe laces. none of that stuff counted. she took a test and it be decided that in our special school it be best to remain. i take the same tests and all of a sudden it’s: “all of that is in there?”
some changes are not good. i hated mine new school and all the pressure to perform different.
much of the movie i realized the true extent of the pressure mine husband be going through that i’ve no inkling of. as i be in the safety of our home and everyday nursing tending to me and our dolphin.
i understand now the terror and pressure of it all as i recall when i be removed from mine special school with it’s eternal never changing preschool setting and into another where it be judged that someone of mine intelligence be best fitted to. they’ve told me that being so not retarded as previously thought i not be allowed to remain in a setting for thus with such limitations. be so i be too clever with mine patterns. be so too clever working puzzles and mathematics and memorizing everything i read. be so it be the end of simple life and school being fun. and the beginning of confused angry everyday teachers that would say, ” how can you know all that you know, and yet you still can’t figure out how to work a doorknob or how to get to the bathroom in time?”
that be somewhat of mine husbands pressure, except he does get to the bathroom in time. it’s just that same sort of pressure i can match it up to. that and having us two depending on him. i still thinks we can live happily ever after in a group home together. but husband says he be not letting that happen.
in the movie Asperger Adam makes his way around everyday people world and learn everyday people ways.
he even has some interactions with his everyday people girlfriend’s pretender breed father who be so a lieing cheating, thieving businessman pretender who ends up going through trial and into jail.
i liked Asperger Movie: “Mozart and The Whale” better. even though Adam gives me more depth into mine husbands stress and issues in his journey into this everyday world.
this be the trailer for Adam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnoNQa_qUm4
but i liked Mozart and the Whale better
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coO2PcRs_Ik
also temple grandin’s movie is coming soon.
http://www.hbo.com/events/templegrandin/video.html
much love and soul singing your way.
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
Autisticsouls,
I saw the movie Adam a few months ago and really enjoyed it. Interesting to hear from your point of view how well it depicted Asbergers. From reading your posts, I find you to be extremely intelligent and sane. I feel you have a lot to teach to everyday people. I am so sorry for your struggles in this complex society. Even if you are one who “fits in” to this society, it is still often very painful being here and fitting in. I sometimes wonder if it would be easier to go live in the Australian outback with the Aborigines, who seem so much more in touch with their spirit-selves.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Recovering…..how about rebounded???
(Report abusive comment)
Rosa says:
I’m with you, OxDrover. I think I’ll just stick with the name “Rosa”, at least for now.
“I’d Rather Be a Bitch Than a Dumb Bitch” is just too darn long.
And, “Did I Shave My Legs For This?” is already a country western song.
Again, a little on the lengthy side, as well.
(Report abusive comment)
recovering says:
ErinBrock: Will the new name require I get a new password, email, phone number and driver’s license? Way too much work…If so, let me stick with the one I got for now….LOL.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
I swear the name changes totally mess with my mind.
I HAVE NO IDEA who people are when they change their name…..Since I don’t have a face…..I make one up for ya’ll….along with identifying your names…..So….in my mind, you are all real and have a ‘personality’ AND a ‘face’.
Probably NOTHING like what you really look like……but hey….I’ts MY mind!!!
Aside from hens…..which that was a no brainer for me…..there was 2 new name changes here….and I HAVE NO IDEA who they are…..things are familiar…spelling and 12 step programs….but?????????
I lost this part of my brain when I had my strokes…..shit….I didn’t even know left from right…..but at least that’s a 50 50 guess of getting it wrong.
The kids taught me if I held up my hands in front of me, the fingers/thumbs that looked like an ‘L” was left…..can you picture this…..someone says turn left and I hold up BOTH hands????
But….I had to do it for about a year……
So…..my vote is……keep the names the same……or if you really want to fuck with me…..switch em up.
(Report abusive comment)
hens says:
ERIN – Just picture me looking like a young Tom Selleck. LOL I wonder how you really picture me? I am 5’11” 175lbs. very short s/p hair, green eyes and a stache. Always tan and hairy all over…and a size 12 shoe
…my youngest son just called and said he figured I would be gettin in my boots and wranglers and starched shirt gettin ready to go out on the town,,,I told him I have not dont that in years – I feel like everybodys grandpa when I go out these days…..Erin I picture you as Julia Roberts–am I close? And as far as the name change – henry to hens is a no brainer – I still have that cast iron skillet shaped head..thanks to miss Oxy…..
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Oh hens…..That was EXACTLY how I pictured you……but I have to say…..maybe not with a size 12…..hahahahaha!
Oh yes….and me…and Julia Roberts…..people ALWAYS mistake me for her….ALWAYS! (I think, maybe I promise…..huh??)
I think the only thing we have in common is our height……
BUT….with the new pilates reformer……I am sure by summer…..me and Julia will be twins for sure! (maybe-kinda sorta)
Actually, I probably look more like you…..stach and all at times…..I’m 5-11 and have a ‘few’ pounds on ya (so don’t mess with me) and i wear a SIZE 11 shoe! (If I were only a man
Hens……you will always be a hunkahunka burnen Tom Selleck to me! EVEN WITH THAT SIZE 12!!!!
(Report abusive comment)
witsend says:
ErinBrock,
Girl, you have some big shoes to fill (no pun intended lol)
I think we all expect you to look like a version of Julia Roberts.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Witty:
No doubt huh…..I don’t think I’ve ever been small….even when I was young.
I’m just a ‘big girl’. Not rolly polly…..just a big jock type chick. Big boned……(I always hated that term)
As a kid, I was called string bean…..tall and lanky…..but always had that ‘j-lo’ butt going on…..it just kept on going on and on as I got older.
I was in the store not long ago and found ‘briefs’ that had butt pads sewn in…….YEAH….that would be NOTHING i’d EVER NEED!!!! The kids laughed when I pulled them off the rack…..
I honest to god never knew they made things like that…..
I have never had a problem filling out the jeans…..
The nice thing about being tall is I never have to alter my clothing. Although jumpsuits are out…..so the 80′s was tough.
Ya’ll keep picturing me how you will…..and keep it flattering huh.
I watched Erin Brockovich again the other day…..I LOVE THAT GIRL!!!! And Julia Roberts was wonderful.
That movie is inspiration……
Even when I watched that movie with the S……he would say…..YOU are so ERIN BROCKOVICH!
DUMB SHIT!!!!
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
and ya know what I do when I need a pick me up….
SHOE SHOP!!!!!
I’m a shoe freak…..and the cool thing about having a size 11 is……you can find them really cheap sometimes……
When we bought this house…..the master bedroom had 3 closets…..so guess what……I GOT A WALKIN shoe closet!
Now you know the real reason I fought so hard to keep this house!!!!
(Report abusive comment)
pollyannanomore says:
Ha erin – I have gone a bit mad shoe shopping lately
Can never have too many pairs. If I change my name, I am thinking
Spath Slayer … what do you think?
(Report abusive comment)
recovering says:
ErinBrock: I never knew they made ‘briefs’ with butt pads sewn in either……Since you don’t need them, I bet your kids got a good laugh when you pulled them off the rack…I can just picture the look.
pollyannanomore — If you do a name change, your “Spath Slayer” idea sounds like a good conversation opener.
So when a new man asks, “What’s a spath?,”you could come up with all kinds of gaslighting — intriguing/entertaining — responses, to keep him on his toes (as in What? WTF? spath-speak).
Love the humor ladies.
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
Okay, I’m getting hip to all the name changes. It always throws me a little. And just so y’all know, I’m 5’4″, 130 lbs., and look exactly like Jennifer Anniston. **coughinmydreamscough**
Well, at least the height and weight are pretty accurate.
I used to have a really nice figure (I was once a stripper) without having to do anything special to get it. Now that I’m 49, I enlist the help of Flexees body trimmers. They are the greatest gift to women who are not in the mood to do Tae Bo every day.
EB, I love shoes. I want a walk-in shoe closet. My entire condo is probably the size of your closet. LOL
(Report abusive comment)
recovering says:
Stargazer (aka Jennifer Anniston look-alike: **coughinmydreamscough**): I’ve read in some celeb mags that you’re trying to rejoin Brad and boot Angie…what up with that? Do you really want a ready-made family? LOL…It’s just my silly self from yesterday evening following me into this morning…loving as much comic relief as possible.
Tell more more about the Flexees body trimmers — I’m in your age group, so could use some more “short cuts” for people with irregular exercise routines.
(Report abusive comment)
justabouthealed says:
STargazer: Okay, so I woke up in the middle of the night last night and told husband we ARE going to start working out again TODAY. So I see your reference to Flexees body trimmers, and go online to look up this great exercise equipment. LOL!!!! Husband might not be able to use it….
(Report abusive comment)
slimone says:
Oh I am so glad I read this thread, or I would have missed the name change and wondered WTF (whereTF) Skillethead hens had gone off to. Phew!
(Report abusive comment)
eileen says:
I’m taller than you EB!
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
Ha ha ha Flexees are something you wear. It’s a one piece body girdle that’s very lightweight but holds in the love handles. You wear it under your clothing and it takes 10 lbs off your midsection seriously! The downside is the it develops runs along the seams, even though the sizes are correct. But the manufacturer is sending me a better model to try instead.
Recovering, if you go to Amazon.com and put in flexees, all the models will pop up. I believe the one I have is the 5056.
JAH, you don’t need a flexees body trimmer. You are already trim in that area and will get no benefit from it.
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
Oh, and BTW, I would never take back that sleazebag, Brad. Those are all rumors. Besides, Tiger Woods is courting me, and he’s in much better shape.
(Report abusive comment)
recovering says:
But Stargazer, Tiger can juggle 8 women at a time apparently. So when would he find time for your love trysts?
If you hook up with him, tell him your comrade on Lovefraud needs more investors for her business. LOL.
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
See what I mean? Any man who can juggle 8 women at a time obviously is in pretty good shape. ha ha ha ha
If you want a good laugh, google the youtube video “Tiger by the Tail”. It’s pretty hilarious.
(Report abusive comment)
miss k says:
PLEASE-I need real help and there are not any therapists listed for my area. I live in San Diego, any suggestions?
(Report abusive comment)
pollyannanomore says:
Miss K email Donna the owner of this site and see if she has any recommendations. Another alternative is to email Sandra Brown at the Institute for Relational Harm Reduction – she has a network of counsellors and therapists across the country who ‘get it’ about these abusive relationships and the inevitable aftermath and fall out from them.
Star – I have a couple of those flexees things – one is a body suit with a bra built into it and the others are like bike shorts that come right up to the bra line. I call them my ‘fat suits’ lol They sure do work though if you have to wear a special dress and don’t want any extra bulges !
Re Tiger – there is a group on fb called ‘I also had an affair with Tiger Woods’ – it has several hundred thousand members – men even! Very amusing
(Report abusive comment)
miss k says:
I will do, thank you.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
MissK
The High conflict Institute also has a training program.
It’s a very interesting company with great approaches.
http://highconflictinstitute.c.....;Itemid=87
They have a referral page with a lot of therapists in SD area that have been through their training.
I can’t personally recommend them, never seen a therapist in that area, but I would imaging it’s worth a look.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
I’m out…..
G’night ya’ll….sleep tight and dreams of nice things…..(or HOT men)!
(Report abusive comment)
miss k says:
Yes it is worth it. Thanks so much. I will check it out in the morning. I am a little tired right now. Thanks to all of you….you just dont know how much you helped me today. I feel so honored.
(Report abusive comment)
kindheart48 says:
hi guys, i was ready over the article above and rereading it and i think i have finally come full circle or at least to some resolve. I recently got involved with trying to help a married detective with his narcissistic wife and long story short he’s back in the funhouse and that’s alright. Im starting to learn my lessons a little faster and in the past i would have carried alot of resentment and anger towards this guy but i just don’t see the point anymore with him or with the s. Yes i am very disapointed, but i know i have to look at my own motives and while i feel that my empathy is what was the main motivator in trying to help these men i also know i have wasted alot of energy and i have only myself to blame for perpetuating the cycle. When i look back with the history with the s i am releived that im not on that roller coaster with stress and anxiety and remorse and i feel i did NOT ever deserve the treatment i got from him but i am responsible for going back each time. I have not made the best choices in men and im at a point that i never ever thought i’d get to and that is i think im pretty ok with myself. After my dad passed and losing my job etc. i’ve been spending alot more time alone and i’ve done alot of reflecting on things and even though i’m not working i feel more contented then i ever have. There was a time when i’d rather be tortured (with the s) then be alone and i don’t feel that way any longer, i no longer need to be entertained. I haven’t give n up hope that there is someone special out ther for me but i don’t need to run around worrying about it or trying to make it happen with someone. As one of my oldest gf’s said i need to make a list of what it is exactly that im looking for anyway, instea d of trying to change people. I really never ever thought i’d get to this place and it’s pretty amazing to just sit here and be grateful, just to be alive. love kindheart
(Report abusive comment)
kindheart48 says:
hey guys was hoping to talk to someone but i guess im on the wrong site. Im actually freaking a bit at all the time im spending alone, it’s so out of character for me but one gf feels it’s been a long time coming and she thinks im starting to really take a good look at reality, only taken me 7 years or more haha. On a serious note she is right, im looking in hindsite over the last year and all i’ve gone through with my dad passing, and distracting myself again with a complete stranger but i didn’t waste as much time or energy this time just a minor detour in life. Starting to put weight back on too. So many posts to read over as i’ve been off the site for quite some time so i’ll be awhile catching up with everyone im afraid. love kh
(Report abusive comment)
witsend says:
kindheart48,
Welcome back…
Sometimes at this time of night it is kind of quiet on LF. To early for the night owls and to late for those that go to bed early.
I was on before reading, but didn’t respond as I have kind of a pressing situation myself and am trying to process through it.
But I am sorry that I didn’t respond to you because I know how it feels to reach out and no body is there. I think we have all felt that from time to time.
Kindheart I think that you already know in your heart that it was a mistake to go down that road with the detective. You don’t need anyone to tell you that. This is the biggest “detour” that we can possibly put ourselves into if we are trying to stay on the road to our own recovery. Trying to “take on” someone elses problems. All it does is take the focus off of us.
Sounds like you were in a very vulnerable state because of your dad and because of loosing your job. But being alone and sorting out all of this and grieving the loss of your dad, can actually be a good thing (in the end result) if you really take the time to FOCUS on you and what you want out of life.
Going to meetings, coming here, planning your future with a new job, and really staying away from all the drama can actually be healing initself. There can be a certain contentment in just getting to know yourself again.
It sounds to me by reading your post that you are “feeling” all of that. Coming to terms with alot of this stuff.
In the past it seems to me that I remember you saying that you are drawn into other peoples problems or drama. Try and reflect on that and figure out why?
I thought you sounded like you are doing good sorting all of this out. Good for you….Pamper yourself sometimes, its the best thing you can do during alone time. Hugs to you.
(Report abusive comment)
Stargazer says:
Kindheart,
I can relate about being alone. I spend a lot of time on the internet sometimes to avoid being alone. It’s a double-edged sword for me because on the one hand, I need the contact and the comraderie. But on the other hand, I need to be in touch with my feelings so that I can have something to share when I come here. It’s easy for me to get lost in helping others with their problems, neglecting my own. Maybe you can experiment with it. Try one evening alone just breathing and being alone with your thoughts. Remember, we’re only a few keyboard strokes away!
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Kindheart:
We need to connect with ourselves and sometimes this is a scary thing, because we know what we have ‘buried’.
Connection is essential to healing and having a brighter, healthier future….
We need to work through our past in order to get to a healthier future.
In order to do this…..we need to spend time alone….
We all make decisions and we can either avoid it or confront it….whatever ‘it’ is…..
Don’t feel bad about spening time alone…..YOU really are good company.
Change up your routine…..and take care of YOU for a change…..get to know YOU, respect YOU, Love YOU…..life is allabout YOU…..
And if you don’t love YOU……you will always find an excuse to avoid YOU.
It’s Okay darling…..it’s okay…..
(Report abusive comment)
geminigirl says:
EB Darling! Thanks for your kind words to mama Gem!
Ive been reading everyones thoughts but have really felt too numb and disconnected to feel much like contributing lately, I still cant get my head round that my daughter is a common thief! And I cant believe she got away with stealing A$50,000 which the company ‘forgave’ her for! Why would they NOT prosecute her? One half of me,{the Mum part,} WANTS her to face justice, but to get off, and the other part wants her to get hr comuppance, and pay for all the shitty things shes done, especilly to me!I wish I knew more about cluster bs, and if she and her sister are genetically linked to their fathers alcoholism, ie, would it have anything to do with their personalities? Its only in the las t8 months or so that Ive had any sort of clue re these monsters,learning about Narcissism, projection, “gaslighting” miroring, etc. before that, I guess I had started to believe my twisted daughters saying everything was MY fault.Its like waking up, painfully from a very bad dream, but having to face reality, that this is the way they are and that they NEVER change.The FOG is lifting, but, like an alcoholic facing the world without a drink, I feel like a pink peeled shrimp, thats just been plunged into boiling water! The good part is that Im FINALLY starting to believe none of this nightmare was MY FAULT, that this is the way they ARE. Horrid thought!Love to you all, esp dear EB.and Witty. {{HUGS}} Mama gem.XX
(Report abusive comment)
one_step_at_a_time says:
Gem – it sounds like waking up from a horrible dream to a nightmare.
about ‘forgiving’ the theft – did she tell you that? Is she lying?
companies don’t lay charges when they have something to hide – when they don’t want someone going over their books, or want to preserve their image. i don’t think it is ever done for altruistic reasons.
and if all that stuff is your fault, you are more powerful than ‘God’ (and I want a pony in that case…oh, and a job, and a spath killing laser)
(Report abusive comment)
JaneSmith says:
Miss Kathleen Hawk,
I was wondering if you have ever heard of the Holy Man Paramahansa Yogananda and his celebrated two books “THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST: The Resurrection of the Christ Within You A revelatory commentary on the original teachings of Jesus”
As a Christian who also incorporates fundamental Eastern Philosophy in my ongoing spiritual growth and realization, I am super curious to read these writings of his.
I am going to the library tomorrow to see if they have it in their selection. If they don’t, I’ll order it online.
Any interesting and enlightening commetary you can offer will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
(Report abusive comment)
JaneSmith says:
Well, that was rather rude of me to not include all the LF members in my last post.
If anyone can offer insight to my request up above I would appreciate it.
I you can’t, no biggie. I’ll still care oodles about you.
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
(Report abusive comment)
ErinBrock says:
Okay……I think it’ll be gone right after I post this…..it seems to be disappearing…..hopefully this will do it….balah, blah…blah…
(Report abusive comment)