Psychopaths in Hollywood
PDF [Hello all. I haven't contributed to lovefraud.com/blog for about six months now. That's not to say that I haven't been keeping up with things here - I have. It's just that I found that I'd got to a dead-end in my thinking on the problem of the psychopath and his prey. After some reflection I believe that I've better handle on the issues and am ready to start participating again. It may be that a book comes out of all this - who know? Thanks to Donna for her patience and encouragement.]
Steve Becker raised the issue of psychopaths in movies a few months ago – I’d like to raise it again. I’ve been watching the second series of the TV show ‘Dexter‘. For those who don’t know it, Dexter is a serial killer who operates according to a code taught to him by his father. Dad, a cop, realised that Dexter was different (socially inept, blood lust, etc.) and so instilled in him the principle that he was not to hurt people in general, but to work at getting along with them. Dexter is permitted to kill only those who deserve it, e.g. killers who’s escaped justice.
Commentators automatically call Dexter psychopathic. That’s what these words seem to mean in the general public: psychopath = serial killer = psychopath.
Hannibal Lector seems to be the association. Either him or a character like Chigurh in ‘No country for old men’. In fact he’s portrayed like a schizoid automaton – where’s the famous psychopathic charm? Only in the scene where he verbally torments the old store-owner get a whiff of psychopathy. It’s not helpful; it’s just one of the reasons regular folks can’t/won’t understand what psychopathy is really like. (For starters, psychopaths aren’t by any means all killers.)
This despite the fact the Dexter himself feels most understood at a program for addicts. (To my mind he’s a pervert.) His girlfriend Lila, though, does seem to me to be a psychopath, though with a definite female bent. A clue, Dexter is wholly likeable whereas Lila is terrifying. A bit like Sante Kimes as depicted in ‘A little thing called murder’.
This public confusion occured around ‘The Sopranos’ too. Donna Andersen has argued that Tony is not a psychopath (she prefers the term sociopath). I agree. (My diagnosis: narcissist – not that it would matter if he had you in his sights.) To me his buddy Paulie ‘Walnuts’ is the true psychopath.
Lovefraud readers have earned the right the hard way to know what is and what isn’t a believably psychopathic. Which movies/shows/books do you think get the essential quality?
jules says:
peacefulnow: hey i watched that movie match point a while ago i watched it with th ex boyfriend spath,i have writen about it here before. my ex spath said in the end ofthe movie oh good ,the bad guy got off. go figure you could have blown me over. at the time i was just starting to figure out what my partner was a s path. the guy in that movie reminds me so much of him all the ph games he plays the lies and the love of money power and lifestyle. how ironic i was watching it with him it was like his life flashing before my eyes. very much spath movie and would advice any one who has been with a spath and moneygrubber to watch and relate to it as i did thru the whole movie. what i like about this movie is how normal this character seemed on the outside to everyone but how deranged he really was, just like the real s paths in our lifes. woody allen got it spot on. also another series is nip tuck the doctor played by julian mcmahn total sex addict and s path. my boyfriend loved that show and idolised the main character in that series so much i think he lives his life like him or tries to.there are a few good movies too i will have to remember them and write more .come to think of it most horror movies are about men terrorising woman in some way, prob why i dont like horror. and of course charlie sheen in two and half men its funny, but what s path charlie is in it. wonder if denise richards squirms when watches him in this. and yes br ad pitt was married when he started with angelina no matter what he says, and all woman like him dont they. holly wood full of s paths. just saw a interview with greg normans ex wife here the other nite, wow he was bad ,she was i think a big victim and his new wife i forgett her name th e tennis player , in the interview the journalist and his ex wife described her as a predator. she told gregs wife now ex while at there house and while he was still happily married that she was drawn to greg and he to her, what the hell was she doing, basically telling his wife im going to have him and im just telling you in your own house. her husband was staying there too at the time.it was so good to see his ex wife finally talking out about him even though his very public persona. they were married 28 years and he gave her no explanations what so ever for leavig for the other woman. then he very publicly married the new woman. i think her name is chris everet or something like that. she went on oprah flashin the massive ring he gave her.. without any respect or dignity toward his wife who supported him right thru his career. he then asked his son to be his best man at the new wedding talk about putting someone on the spot and in a awkward position. the whole interview showed norman in another light, i always thought he was arrogant. he was very upset about the interview being aired in his home country aus. i thought it was great to see her finally telling the truth of the story from her side cause the other two were all over the media at the time it was so tacky to watch. maybe he is not a spath i dont know enough about him but i dont think him or his new wife are very nice or kind polite or caring people. anyone else know anything about this story. please feel free to coment.oh and his ex wife refused money paid for the inter veiw.
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femfree says:
Mental Illness in the Movies
http://faculty.dwc.edu/nicosia.....graphy.htm
I’m a big fan of Dexter, alas here in Canada where I am we can’t get it. I got at the videostore Season 2 of the series.
Dexter is evil, but one character in the show that had the hair on the back of my neck rising was Lila, his pyromaniac / borderline girlfriend. They got good writers.
Cheers!
femfree
(financial & emotional freedom)
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OxDrover says:
Femfree, Do I know you from another blog?
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quest says:
my favourite female psychopath movie is” basic instinct 2 “. I did not know there was a basic instinct 2 until about 3 months ago . Sharon stone is in the first and the second movie . I feel that the second movie is a classic and that Sharon Stone should have got an emmy for her portayal of a psychopath . While watching the movie it dawned on me that in order to play the part so well she must be a psychopath herself . Either that or the director sure as hell new lots about psychopaths . In the movie some of the aspects of a psychopath are quite subtle and I am sure that most people would probably not pick up on all these subtle aspects unless they had been involved with a psychopath . Psychopaths in my opinion have a different way of talking than most people and they seem to have a distinctive way of useing body language as well . I seem to have a sixth sense for these aspects that seems to set off a warning bell somewhere in my consciousness any time I am exposed to it . The only problem with having this perception is that I believe that the psychopath knows that I can see them and this has generally tended to piss them off . Needless to say whenever I get into a situation where I believe I have found a psychopath I usually try not to have eye contact with them as it is at that time they realise that I can see them . Not to say that I am infalible as some psychopaths are harder to see than others . It is also my opinion that the difference between narcissitic people , and psychopaths may be almost non existant . A narcissist is just an under diagnosed psychopath . What is the difference between the likes of ted bundy and the psychopaths I run into at work . Personally I think , not much . I think that all psychopaths are capable of murder , its just a question of what sets them off . The concept of what sets them off is something that I have wondered about for the last 7 months since I left my X . To most people she is the somewhat ditsy excentric exhibitionist . I know better , she is smart , cunning , manipulative , selfish and hides a nastiness behind her phoney smile that would chill almost anyones blood if they could see it . Unfortunately most can’t . When I run into a psychopath it is this nastiness that I see even if it is hiding behind a mask of sanity . A mask is only a mask and is easily spotted once you have been involved with a psychopath and seen what is hiding behind that mask . So then what sets a psychopath on the path to become a serial killer . One theory I have goes like this . When a normal person realises their own death it is a moment of enlightenment . Unfortunately most people I feel do not realise their own deaths . Sure most people know they are going to die at some point but to realise the concept is a little different . To test if someone has realised their own death I ususally ask them if they remember the day and where they were . Most people will say something like , “I have always known “. This is a sure sign to me that they haven’t as when I realised my own death I have never forgotten the moment and where I was . It was too profound a moment to ever forget . What happens if a psychopath realises his own death .
Think about that for a moment . A self centered , egotistical , narcissitic , totally selfish psychopath realises his own mortality . We all know how tempramental a psychopath can be . What happens in their head when they realise that they the center of their universe is just a little something in between nothing . Before they were born there was nothing and when they die there will be nothing again . Are they the ultimate hollywood hero who is not supposed to die , and now suddenly that whole elusion is gone . Suddenly there is no reason to maintain the mask , the true nasty is revealed just like the psychopath in the movie , No Country for old men . That guy had given up on the mask , thats why there was no charm and no phoney smile , he was being his true self .
On a side note I have watched about 70 movies in the last six months that had something to do with psychopaths . During that time , in fact in all my life I believe I have only seen one movie that was all about the realisation of death . That movie was called ,”Stranger than Fiction,” with Will Ferrel . I would call that a must see movie . cheers
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keeping_faith says:
It seems to me that all of the characters in the above article are sociopathic/narcissistic and psychopathic to varying degrees.
Does Hanibal seem more dangerous simply because he is prtrayed as “colder” in the films? Dexter scares the crap out of me quite honestly because he seems so normal. He reminds me a lot of the x sociopath I was with. Is he considered to be glamorized because he goes around killing criminals?
It seems that they all have the intent to harm, some just make the choice to break the law to different degrees, but the basis for power and control are still there regardless.
The x sociopath I dealt with told me that he killed people. Did he? I don’t want to believe it but if he does believe it long enough he may actually do it. I don’t want to be around if he makes that choice.
We are a society intrigued by sociopathy/psychopathy and analyzing people who seem less than human. Who watches CSI and Law and Order? Fascinating….and some of these crimes are based on true stories.
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keeping_faith says:
I think that true sociopaths/psychopaths “fake” their emotions very well. We believe that those who stand out as more “mean” or more “angry” or “cold hearted”, are the ones we should fear. That’s the problem with this dosorder….. it’s not so clear up front. That’s why anyone can be affected. Victims are not just those oblivious or uneducated.
It’s the ones who are better at imitating healthy emotions that we should be afraid of…….that’s why it takes some of us longer than others to figure out what we were dealing with right? The X P I knew cried a lot and was able to generate empathy and pity from thsoe around him. I didn’t realize until later than whenever he cried while he told a story, it was usually a lie. And they were some pretty bizarre stories.
They seem normal but we don’t see the truth sometimes until it’s too late….. otherwise, these blogs and the books and the researchers and drs. and other victims would be able to save everyone from the grasp of these individuals….. you don’t know what it is until it happens. And you don’t believe it until it affects you personally.
Hollywood portrays them for the purpose of entertainment. (A cleaner, faster plot with more defined characters). In real life it happens over a longer period of time without commercial breaks and coming attractions….it’s too bad huh? But sometimes there is no less drama, abuse or violence.
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Stargazer says:
Has anyone ever seen “The Temp”? Classic cold, scheming psychopath.
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Wini says:
Quest: Interesting! Are you saying that you believe there is nothing prior to birth and nothing after death?
Could you elaborate on this concept? How did you come to this deduction?
Peace.
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quest says:
Hi Wini, when I realised my own death I was about 21 and had set off from my home country some 6 months before to roam the world in search of the meaning of life . I was obviously young , green and niave . When the revelation of the realisation of my own death hit me I was sitting in a park on a park bench on a hot sunny day . A week or two before I had seen a total eclipse of the sun . Whether that had anything to do with it or not I couldn’t say . Realising ones own death is somewhat like having a eureka moment of understanding when you figure out how not only to do a math problem but you also understand how it works . For the next 2 years I do not believe I made a decision on anything without bringing into play the realization of death . Anytime I was nervous about something I was about to do the nervousness went away as soon as my inevitable mortality was brought into the equation . Not to say that I did things that were obviously going to put my life in jeopardy like jumping out of a two story window . With death as my friend I actually had more confidence . I believe that with death as your friend one tends to live a little more in the now than most people . The other thing about realising your own death is that at the same time you then actually realise you are alive and that life is a little something in between nothing . With all this in mind I believe that the quest for truth then takes on a more realistic feel . Sure I thought about God a number of times , but he never showed up for dinner . I thought about reincarnation but I have no real proof of it . When I have questioned people on christianity and their faith it sounds as stupid as me believing in the tooth fairy. As one wise soul said , ” God is just a make believe friend for adults “, . It seems to me that the psychopathic mind set has been affecting the direction of humanity for quite some time , and if it is going to be over come then the sane people will have to be at least realistic . Heres a question I asked myself in the last 5 months , “Was Jesus christ a psychopath . My X was a very religious person or so she said . Infact it was just part of her mask of sanity . I used to go to church with her , not because I was religous , but more to keep her company . I suppose I was somewhat fascinated by what the preacher had to say on occasion as sometimes I could hardly believe what I was hearing . What it amounted to was psychopathic bable .I did not realise this until I had read a few books on the subject of psychopaths after me and my X split up . If you base your life on a premice that is flawed right from the start how can one make a realistic decision about anything . I suppose out of this comes the thought that I would rather have real experience than have what so many people call faith. America today is a country on the edge of downfall . If their faith was real the country would never have got to this position . What is required is realistic decisions to be made by real people . What we have instead is a bunch of psychopaths ripping off the american people to the tune of trillions of dollars . Will Obama be able to fix it . I doubt it . By the time he gets into the white house I feel there will be nothing left to fix . The same people that caused the banking crisis are the same people that are supposedly going to fix it . If they could fix it , it should never have happened in the first place . The psychopathic mind set is all around us , manipulating , deceiving and generally doing nasty stufff . They are the minority we should with a little awareness be able to overcome the distortions of reality that they like to inflict upon us .
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henry says:
Quest – I just love reading your post – you and I are on the same planet – so many in here find comfort with their faith in Jesus or God – I just dont feel it – I know I will get some flack about this – but – I do believe their is a higher inteligence – their is a something out there – and I dont want to debate religon – I think of my self as spiritual – I was brainwashed as a child by the Jehovas Witness Cult -not by my choice but my mothers – the guilt and shame they inflicted upon me still gives me nitemares. I am a gay man and I have more values more morals more ethic’s then either one of my hypocrit insestous parent’s ever hoped to have and I have lived most of my life to please them – why? I will never know. I believe in Karma and I strive to be good to every human and animal – and I treat the planet with respect. We never will know what await’s us on the other side if anything. This is neither here nor their – but I just wanted to say how much I agree with you.
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Wini says:
quest: Interesting. I never thought about the concepts of my death … I do understand my mortality. I almost died already, as a teenager. Would have been a really stupid death … so I’m glad it didn’t happen the way it was playing out. I was very lucky. And, I prayed to God at that minute, “not now, not like this” … and then it was over.
I do believe in God and I’ve had a lot of proof in my life over the years that he does exist. If you research the history of religion, you will understand the complexity of the different religious groups. I find reading Bibles very interesting and very eye opening as far as what man kind is all about. Anything that could happen with man, is already written in the Bible. Even all the anti-social personalities are written about through out the pages in the Bible.
I agree with you that the psychopaths got to the top of these corporations and the banking industry. Let’s bring some folks from the ranks that are real … let the rest go to retirement (too young to retire? Too bad, you were in the wrong place at the wrong time during the collapse of our economy as we once new it) and let’s call it a day with choosing big ego idiots to get to the top, because they believe they need to be at the top. That’s a big RED flag for everyone … and we need to ensure the checks and balances are back in place for promoting people through the ranks again (government and private industry). That promotions are for doing a good job and comprehending how and why you did this job, before a promotion. Not this nonsense of networking of one psychopath hiring another psychopath taking everything for them, having party time on the American publics’ back along with their company’s back. As we can see from this blog, anti-social personalities give every lip service. There is no substance to any of them except their greed and what’s in it for them.
I think Obama is a no nonsense individual. I see a lot of compassion in him. I’m glad he won. I think he’ll prove to be the best president that has happened to this country in a long, long time. Since he was a mover and a shaker at the lower levels … levels where the average person wouldn’t bother to work in, never mind care enough to resolve issues … I think he’ll bring that strategy on to the world stage. He does need to weed out the psycho personalities in Government as well. I’m watching the folks he’s choosing this week, it’s pretty interesting … and all of them seem conscientious and level headed to me. That’s a good sign. I think with a dedicated, real team of people, this man can turn what these psychos did to our country and get us up and running again. Everyone needs to understand that they need to tighten in their belt.
Your comment about there is nothing left by the time he takes office. He already knows there is nothing left … so he’s got to make lemonade out of the lemons.
I understand that there are a lot of psycho’s out there … and I wished the younger generations would stop being idiots and stop emulating them. That’s a big waste of time, when feeling people throw their hands in the air and start acting like anti-social personalities … with the “who cares attitude … every one is doing it, why shouldn’t I”? We’re in big trouble because it’s hard to tell a real person from a psycho. Which the psychos love because it makes it harder to detect them. I feel it in my soul that the reign of the psychopaths finally collapsed and that is what we are witnessing now.
I have faith everything will work out for the better.
Peace.
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Wini says:
Henry: You’re not alone with being pressured by religious control freaks. That’s what most people have felt over the last 40-50 years. I believe it was do to the anti-social personalities swarming over the flock and taking over. Church leaders didn’t know how … or want to … handle it … and that is what we saw played out in the public eye over the years. My adviser told me this the ultimate of the devil at work in full swing wanting people to leave their churches, not having guidance nor being involved with community. Leaving people in fear and confusion for not wanting to attend a structured environment.
It is however, everyone’s responsibility to read and gain wisdom from the Bible. To do so, on your own, at your pace, has absolutely nothing to do with having to be involved with a structured religion.
I do see a swing back to people attending their churches and feeling very comfortable in doing so today. There is nothing like feeling welcome by your fellow man.
Peace.
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OxDrover says:
I think we have have had this discussion about religion being a great “cloak” for the psychopath to use to cover up their bad deeds. Plus, religious “leadership” is also a great “con job” for the unprincipled psychopath to gain control over the “flock” and lead them off down the “garden path” in order to victimize them financially etc.
Some scandal rag magazine did an expose of the homes lived in by some of the “great” tele-evangelists today who are always begging for donations from the little old ladies who watch. These are 10-20-30 MILLION DOLLAR HOMES set way back in 30-40 acre remote “estates” which were photographed by helicopter by the magazine. The homes are not ones that you can “drive by” and see.
It’s odd that Jesus didn’t own a home and his “ministers” have mansions while begging for donations from their “flock.” What is wrong with this picture?
In Jesus’ day the Jewish “religious leaders” had also sold out to the Romans and were binding rules on the people that didn’t apply to themselves, so this is nothing new, and not unique to Christianity by any means. Religion is just in some cases a way or a P to assume power and control over others, just as politics and money and social status can also be used for the same purposes.
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Wini says:
Yes Oxy: I was trying to say, no matter what ego personalities in this world should do or have done to pit us against each other … we can have faith and seek wisdom on our own as well as knowing it’s OK to live a righteous life, the way our creator wants us to live.
To live in harmony with one another. Which is what the anti-social personalities have done to all of us, by pulling the rug out from under us, pushing us to the curb of life, climbing to the top of everything and playing their stupid games with all of humanity, not just us singularly, but everyone. We no longer have to wonder what’s going on in this crazy world. We know the answer that it’s lip service folks running this world into the ground and how none of them cared.
We no longer have to question ourselves and what did we do to deserve any of this. We did nothing wrong. They did wrong and now everyone around the world is witnessing how wrong they are. Now that we know we do matter to God, we can make a difference. How they live is nonsense. All fluff, no substance. Now the world is seeing there is no substance to any of them … giving everyone lip service … flying on corporate jets to ask for a handout!
It’s a big eye opener to the real people of the world, that we did it right, we care, we love and respect each other. We do make a difference in this world, not them. God has allowed the entire world to see on a grand scale what they are all about. No longer can they be the man behind the curtain pretending to everyone, giving everyone lip service, smiling to our faces and lying through their teeth.
Actually, I think their house of cards falling down all around them so the world can watch is fantastic. Everyone gets to see what a bunch of hot air they truly are.
Hey, it was all on God’s time … and he just showed us that if we had patience and waited, he would not forsake us.
Keep the faith … we are witnessing a miracle in it’s full Glory.
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kat_o_nine_tales says:
Big news in Rochester a couple of weeks ago was Aurthur Shawcross dying in jail at 63 (natural causes). He was Rochester’s very own serial killer, and I never realized how much hatred the city had for him until I heard the radio callers that day.
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Wini says:
kat: I believe Shawcross was interviewed extensively. I forgot if it was his ego (with no child abuse against him in his childhood) that lead him to his crimes or he was abused as a child and that started his acting out.
Do you remember the specifics of the analysis on him?
Peace.
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keeping_faith says:
Is that Rochester NY?…..that’s where the S/P I was with came here from.
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