The verbal attacks of the sociopath
PDF Editor’s note: The following article was submitted by the Lovefraud reader Aloha Traveler.
Who are you calling BLEEP!?
I have always been a person that is hard-wired for honesty. If you are into astrology, I am an Aries and my Chinese sign is Rooster. This doesn’t mean much to me but a friend once wanted to know my birth sign and the year and then responded “Oh. Now I see.” According to my friend, Aries born in the year of the Rooster have a double scoop of honesty.
What does this have to do with a being the victim of a disordered person? I’ll tell you. When they are attacking you, they never say anything true about you. The Bad Man was always insisting that I was a very dishonest woman. How odd. No one had ever called me this, ever. He also insisted I was “rude” and “selfish.” This was early in the relationship while I still had some spunk left in me to fight back. I countered, “I am 35 years old. I have never heard this about myself before. Don’t you think that if it were true, I would have heard this about myself by now?” I was sure of this. I thought I had him. I was unsure of this—his response, “That is why your ex left you. Because you can’t see how you are.”
This was brilliant on his part. I was unsure as to why the ex, a Good Man, decided I wasn’t “The One.” Of course, I had already shared this information with the Bad Man in those early, deep, soul-baring conversations that are part of the Sociopathic Relationship Package. True to his nature, the Bad Man had already dug into my psyche like an archeologist and carefully uncovered every vulnerability within me. My logic, I was sure of. Why the man I loved for five years left me, I wasn’t so sure.
SCORE 1 for the Bad Man.
The Bad Man claimed that I communicated in “cunning and tricky ways.” If you have ever read anything I have written in the blogs or my other essays, what do you think? Is there anyone in Lovefraud land that experiences me as cunning and tricky? I have been told all of my life that I am very direct. This was so confusing. The Bad Man seemed to be operating in some other dimension… the dimension where I was cunning, rude, tricky, BLEEP, feisty, testy, BLEEP, BLEEP, BLEEPITY- BLEEP-BLEEP, sleazy-cheesy, dishonest, ornery, blah, blah, blah and on and on.
Romeo’s Bleeding
In the essay Romeo’s Bleeding, Part 5, the author, Roger Melton, puts it this way:
“Just keep one simple fact always in mind, regardless of whether a Controller is borderline, narcissistic, sociopathic or sadistic: Whenever any of them are criticizing characteristics in you, they are making autobiographical statements about themselves.
Blame is their way of unloading their character defects onto you. Listen closely to the hateful things they say to you about you. You are listening to verbatim descriptions of their character defects. This is extremely important to remember, especially in the midst of verbal attack. These are the only moments when you will hear the truth about the man who lies concealed behind the steel wall of his personality disorder.”
The Romeo’s Bleeding series explains a great deal about the methods, whether consciously, unconsciously, or instinctively, that disordered people use on their unsuspecting victims. I have found that accepting the Bad Man’s behavior as just part of the formula for an abusive disorder has helped me to let go of the horrible things he said to me. Honestly (there I go again), his attacks on my character no longer hold any sting for me. Letting go of all the horrible things that part of you absorbed is like performing a detox on your psyche and I believe it is a very important part of healing for all of us.
Never in my life have I encountered such a damaging human being. If I were to continue to carry his words with me, I wouldn’t want to get up each day and go on. There was a short period of time when I was with Bad Man where I remember looking in the mirror and feeling like I was the most worthless human being to ever walk the earth. This was when my sense of self was so weakened that he had nearly total buy-in from me about all the horrible things he said about me, to me. I believe that is part of the hook of carrying on with these disordered people; we want to prove that we aren’t the way they said we are. I know this was true for me. I would get so close to the proverbial door in my mind and then he would say something so outrageous that I couldn’t stand to walk away without defending my character and proving him wrong.
Ask your friends
In the blogs, I have advised a reader or two to ask friends or loved ones, people who have known you all your life, to describe you, to you. This is much more likely to be an accurate picture of you. You will be surprised at the generosity you may find among your true friends and loved ones. Some of the things people said to me when I was first out of this nightmare struck me so deeply in my wounded heart. I had been through such cruelty and the words of true friends were like a salve that reduced me to tears and reminded me that goodness does exist in me and outside of me.
Here’s a fun way to deal with healing that wound in you. Just to be silly, you can take the worst things your Bad Man or Bad Woman said to you and make your own game of MadLibs. Remember those? Write out one of the classics (one you feel you could never forget) that has been ruminating in your head for however long and delete all the icky parts and then read it to a friend and have them fill in the blanks for you like this:
Elise, you are such a ____________________woman!
Positive adjective here
Let’s close today with a little musical therapy. You are going to BLEEPING LOVE this!
Barbra Streisand sings Cry Me A River.
Links to Romeo’s Bleeding
I highly recommend the Romeo’s Bleeding series of articles sent to me by PeggyPseu. Thanks Peggy!
Romeo’s Bleeding: When Mr. Right Turns Out to Be Mr. Wrong
By Roger Melton
Part 1: Control
Part 2: The Malice Artists
Part 3: The Mirror Men
Part 4: When Love is a 4-Letter Word
Part 5: When love is a 4-Letter Word cont. The Clinging Apocolypse
Part 6: Conclusion: Counter-control
written by Lovefraud Reader • Permalink •
kat_o_nine_tales says:
Just read these posts for the first time. Molly I hope you are still with us somewhere.
You too Ealain, and I had to make flashcards too. I still read them, and they help me a lot.
(Report abusive comment)
jofary says:
Oh my God! The words I keep reading on this particular post sting me over and over again and any doubt I ever had about my ex-P’s are over:
* soul mates
* integrity
*entitlement
*blame-shifting
*enraged when exposed
*giver (him), taker (me)
*victim (him), controlling (me)
I haven’t written for a while, but I’ve been skimming, learning and absorbing when I can. Thank you, Aloha, for this post and all the responses that have echoed my own life. (Have we all been involved with the same person?!!?). I wish I could give you a hug, too. You’ll never know how much I appreciate having MY integrity and strength of character reaffirmed (not those who attempted to steal it for their own). Thank you, thank you, thank you!
(Report abusive comment)
henry says:
jofary – You condensed a novel of our live’s with these people into one defining paragraph—-thank you
(Report abusive comment)
James says:
“Just keep one simple fact always in mind, regardless of whether a Controller is borderline, narcissistic, sociopathic or sadistic: Whenever any of them are criticizing characteristics in you, they are making autobiographical statements about themselves.
I really like this thread! These projection that PD make is mind blowing!
I just had to end a relationship with someone I started dating just a few weeks ago. It was such a trip. She started with the “projection” concerning who she thought I was. Now that I know what a projection is I told her so. Yet she had no reply to my statement. I was inquisitive so once I even ask her a question. My question was “why do you think I am trying so hard to understand what you are saying about me, it is because you think I will use this information later to use it against you? Her reply was YES!
OMG! I of course stated the I would never do that and in fact I am trying to understand you and what you believe because I am interested in you and would like to help us both understand why you feel like that. That I am trying to validate what you are saying and feeling.
Well, I could handle all her projections and was hoping we both could learn from this. But when she violated a personal boundary the time she showed up one night while I was working to “visit my children” and upsetting my oldest. I had enough!!!
After my son call me on my cell at work and inform me, “dad she was here and I told her she couldn’t come in because you were at work”.. I thanked my son and told him that I will deal with it when I get home. I couldn’t believe it!!!!
After getting back home and calming down I call my soon to be ex dating partner and told her that “okay maybe you (she) didn’t know but friends of mine don’t come over and visit my children without my personal permission and that this is a family rule”. Her reply was: Oh, I told you I was gonna stop by…
OMG! This person just lied to me!!!!
My reply was: No you didn’t tell me because if you did I would have say NO!!!! And in case I just lost my mind and said yes, I would have inform my son that you were coming by!
Well being a single parent you don’t mess with my children… Please someone tell me this is something you need to tell an adult? I know she doesn’t have children of her own but still???
Anyway I ended the relationship (God we only dated a few weeks not sure if I can even call it that?) ASAP!!!
Okay, projections I can deal with..
Violating personal boundaries.. No! that you don’t do!! Even more so when it concerns my children‘s warfare and safely!!!
Thanks for letting me share this with you readers and getting it off my chest. Somedays I still can’t believe this happen. Well we live and learn don’t we. New rule for me is that I will not allow anyone I date to see or come over to my house until we dated a “FEW MONTHS”!!!! And if she ask me why? I will just have to tell her this story…
(Report abusive comment)
kat_o_nine_tales says:
James.. that was one of the things that was my first red flag with my ex-bf, he didn’t seem to understand common basic tenets of relationships. He was always verbally respectful, but he just made no changes to show that we were dating. He still called and wrote to all his former dating prospects, stayed on all the dating sites, didn’t introduce me to very many people. I told him early on.. I”m not going to be your dirty little secret. And of course this was the issue that I left him over, and the issue he pretended to have resolved to draw me back, so he could dump me himself.
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Dear James,
HOORAY FOR JAMES!!!!
You saw the RED flags and you shot them down. Good for you!!!!!! It sounds to me like she was on a “fishing expedition” to get information about you from your children. Typical P behavior. They realize that Knowledge=power=control=ammunition. So they will sneak around to try to get it any way they can.
I don’t blame you at all about not letting ANYONE with your children when you are not around. And HOORAY FOR JAMES’ SON AND FOR JAMES for training his son not to give in to let her in. He abided by your rules for his safety. Good for you James for teaching him well, and good for him for listening to your advice.
I agree that I would not let someone meet my children even with me present until the relationship got pretty “serious” or at least “long term potential” and before I knew them well.
I personally don’t think it is a good idea to have varous adult “friends” in and out of your children’s lives that may not be there long or may cause problems.
Yes, A SINGLE LIE is enough for me. This didn’t seem like such a “big” LIE yet, it showed that she would lie to cover up for herself and as far as I am concerned a lie=a lie=a lie= a person I don’t want in my life, much less in the life of my young children.
(Report abusive comment)
muldoon says:
OMG why the hell havent I read this stuff before I understand it all and can empathise with the writer…thought it only me!!
(Report abusive comment)
Wini says:
James: If she said acknowledged her mistake for overstepping your boundaries, I could understand.
What happened to the words “I am sorry” in our society? Must have been lost with the word “humble”.
Piece of cake, piece of pie.
Smile, at least you got out for a few weeks. We have to remember to just DATE again and not look for that long term relation. God will grant that upon us when he feels the time and person is the right partner for us.
(Report abusive comment)
muldoon says:
Just read romeo lies bleeding…I feel liberated it has blown me away…Realsie he is borderline narcistis….his descriptions were exactly how it was and is…I dd have ainkling of hope that there may be this been a mistake or some illness and mayve we would one day get back together…it was only tiny now and then….evn that is gone i have never been so certain of anything in all my life. God I ove this place…learnt and understood more than years of trawling forums and links.
(Report abusive comment)
James says:
A update to my story is that I (I still believe God allow this to happen) I ran into this person at a Jewel food store one day…
I told her how sad it was the way things worked out and even sorry (for what I still don’t know) but felt that is what we tell each other in an uncomfortable situation. Guess I am still a enabler and always will be.. But I am working on it!
Anyway she told me how she met someone and they were planning on getting married next spring/summer and told her how I wish her to best of luck. At one point (I was proud of myself for this) she wanted to discuss what happen but I told her I thought it was best not to open this can of worms again. And that I didn’t wish to speak of it anymore. If I thought it would help her or me I would have talked with her concerning it but from her tone I could see it coming from a point of blame and all I wanted was for both of us not to blame but heal and leave it along. I thank God I was allow to speak with her and find some type of middle ground.. Anyway again I wish her the best of luck and walk away then she called to me and gave me a hug. It felt good to know for me anyway I did what I believed was right and that no one got hurt. I do hope it works out for her with this other person but I have my doubts.. This is the only thing I regret (feeling this way) and hope I am wrong and all will be okay with her. Like anyone we all deserve a little happiness in our lives…
(Report abusive comment)
Wini says:
James: The new guy (victim) will be blogging with us sooner than you can blink your eyes … LOL.
I’m glad you took the high road.
Peace.
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Dear Muldoon,
That’s what I mean about “KNowledge=Power”—the more you learn the TRUTH about the situation, the more you will be able to be strong and control your life, rather than having HIM control it. It is scary to be “in control ” of your own life, and relaize that your life depends on YOU, that there is no one out there that you can just put all your faith in and they will take care of you. It would be nice if you could just let someone else make all your decisions and be good to you, provide for you, etc. but GOD is the only one we can completely depend on except ourselves. Being adult means making your own decisions. YOu can share love with someone (if you are fortunate enough to have someone) but even then, in the end YOU are responsible for your own life.
I’m 62 years old, and I have an “adult” my entire life, but at the same time, I have let my happiness depend on others, and sometimes those others are NOT trustworthy. There have been good and trustworthy people in my life, but because not all were trustworthy I didn’t TRUST IN MYSELF to take full responsibilityl. Now I am, and life is much better. I will no longer let anyone abuse me. I won’t abuse others, but I will take care of ME. I must be able to depend on myself.
I am so glad that you are learning that there is NO hope for you and your X together, he is not going to change. You don’t like the pain of life with him, so you must trust yourself to do good things for YOU and your children. You cannot trust him. You CAN make good decisions for yourself and your children.
Good luck and my prayers for you—keep reading!! Keep learning, and keep strengthening your own inner power and strengths!! (((hugs))))
(Report abusive comment)
alohatraveler says:
Hello Muldoon,
I see you have read Romeo’s Bleeding. Eye opening isn’t it? Life changing isn’t it? These articles knocked the air out of me. I wrote this essay simply as a way to introduce those articles because they were so critical to my getting it about Bad Man. I was starting to get it but boy did the author spell it out! I wanted everyone to read these!
I did hold out a teeny tiny hope for a long time that the Bad Man would come around in his thinking. Before I met him, it was unfathomable to me that human beings could act this way, or be wired this way. Now I know.
There are a lot of beautiful articles about healing written by M.L. Gallagher. You can read them all by going directly to her tab. She is one of the official authors. When I first found LF, there was only 23 articles if I remember correctly and I devoured them in a few nights. You have a lot of material to wade through here. If the “Romeo’s Bleeding” articles are striking a cord with you, you are definately in the right place.
You will feel better with time. I am so glad you found LoveFraud.
Take care,
Aloha
(Report abusive comment)
alohatraveler says:
Dear Oxy,
The first paragraph of your post… this is my lesson boiled down to it’s essense.
I wanted to rely on someone else so bad. My family let me down. I thought a man would make that up for me one day. I will be 40 in April and I am just now getting it, that this really is it… and it really is up to me to take care of me.
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Dear Aloha,
I think it is a lesson that many people never get. I took “forever” to truly get it. NO one can “make me happy” and NOTHING can make me happy, I a responsiblle for my own life, and my own happiness. Circumstances are usually not in our control…as the Bible says, we can’t make ourselves taller or change that sort of thing. The apostle Paul counseled his disciples/christian brothers to BE CONTENT in whatever situation they were in…i.e. I think he meant that no matter what “circumstances” you have that you CANNOT CHANGE (he even mentioned if you were a slave and could not get “free”) that you need to accept them and be content and satisfied anyway. Good advise I think.
I worked with lots of people (of all ages) who were spinal cord injured and many of them never adjusted because it was always “If only I could walk….I would be satisfied.” So since their “dream” couldn’t come true they were perpetually unhappy, dissatisfied etc. and bitter and disappointed in life in general.
My best friend (I met her when her son was my patient) treated her son like he was still a human, who just HAPPENED to be in a wheel chair. He today is a fully functioning human being, he is still paralyzed from the neck down, but he LIVES LIFE AND IS HAPPY, and well adjusted—just happens to be in a wheel chair. Finished college, got a GF, then married, etc.
There are many things we can’t change about ourselves that hamper our “dreams” being fulfilled. I’m 62, and not likely to have another “soul mate,” but I cna’t change that, but I can live a happy and contented life for what remains to me. After my husband died I was NOT CONTENT to be (at that time) 57, and “alone.” Now, I am CONTENT alone, and if per chance I find someone, fine, but in the meantime I am CONTENT and not grieving over what I cannot change (my wrinkles and gray hair and sagging boobs! LOL)
I AM RESPONSIBLE FOR ME. My sons are resonsible for themselves, I am so glad that we have each other and can SHARE that love and respect for each other and help each other in other ways as well, but I am NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THEM, NOR THEY FOR ME.
I loved my husband and I miss him, but I should have depended more on myself for my happiness and contentment and less on him for that. So though it was a GOOD relationship, I put too much dependence on something that I could not control. Something that was external to me.
I am so glad that you are making so much progress, Aloha, I am glad that we all are. I am glad that LF is here and I have met so many courageous people here..people who are strugging just as I am to heal and move forward. To support me and whom I cna support, but in the end, it all boils down to we have to take responsibility for ourselves TOTALLY. (((hugs))) and God bless!
(Report abusive comment)
Healing Heart says:
The “providing one’s own happiness” concept seems to be one that is so important. And critical that we actually commit to this, rather than pay lip service to this. Certainly for years I have known from all the spirituality books I have read – which have been quite a range from old world shamanism to tenets of the new age movement (which all have the roots in old world faiths), that we need to provide our happiness for ourselves, by connecting with ourselves and God within us. I knew this, could speak about it, and even give others pep talks about it. But I didn’t truly get it.
I know that now for certain because I put my happiness in my ex S hands. Certainly in the past I had looked to men and romantic relationships to feel whole, but in my last relationship, with the ex S, I took it to a whole new level. In part because he ardently promised that he could make me happy, and in part because I was willing and eager to believe. I loved the idea that bonding with this man would bring me happiness for all subsequent years of my life. How easy is that!!!!
But I knew, at some level, that it was never going to work.
You cannot get your happiness from a romantic partner or a romantic relationship. I think that was one of the huge lessons that God needed me learn. I’d been dancing around that one for a while, but apparently wasn’t getting it.
Now, I get it.
It’s really exciting in some ways to think I could make myself happy. TRULY happy. I have much more faith in me than any of the scoundrels and clowns I have looked to in the past to do this for me. There is a good chance I may make myself happy!
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Dear HH,
Last night I was reading a few passages in the Bible before I finally went to sleep (it was one of those “I have to get up early mornings, but I’m lying here AWAKE worrying about it and the worry about it won’t let me go to sleep” nights! LOL) and I read where Jesus told His disciples that if they had the faith of the (size) of a mustard seed they could move mountains! FAITH! Faith in our God (or higher power as we see them) and FAITH IN OURSELVES.
I read on about so me of the healings that Jesus accomplished and the one where the woman said to herself “If only I can touch the hem of his garment I will be healed” and she did and she WAS healed. When Jesus spoke to her he said “YOUR FAITH HAS MADE YOU WHOLE” FAITH!!! Faith!!! YOUR FAITH in yourself will make it SO!
I have had traiining in hypnosis, biofeedback and in meditation and other “alternative” medicine aspects and I can, simply by BELIEVING IT, raise the temperature in the palm of my hand–BECAUSE I BELIEVE I CAN. I can slow my heart rate to 40, dampen down my respiration rate to very very low BECAUSE I BELIEVE I CAN. I know that “gettiing rid of warts” (which are caused by a virus) is easily done PSYCHOLOGICALLY if the person BELIEVES (medical science has now proven this with testing) THE POWER OF OUR SUBCONSCIOUS is AWESOME!!!!
WE CAN HEAL OURSELVES if we WANT TO, and if we BELIEVE WE CAN, if we HAVE FAITH IN OURSELVES TO DO IT. I don’t think it is some “way out miracle” or some hoo-doo, or hocus pocus, it is REAL, I have seen it, I have experienced it, but I for whatever reason DIDN’T HAVE FAITH. Faith in myself, faith in my higher power. Mostly I think, faith in MYSELF.
I accept that not every cancer, or every human ill can be cured by “wishful thinking” and that is not what I am talking about with “FAITH IN MYSELF” I think sometimes I at least and maybe others substitute “wishful thinking” for FAITH in ourselves.
“I wish (or I just know that) if ‘John’ would quit being so mean to me, we could be so happy. Maybe if I did _______(fill in the blank) he would see how he is hurting me and making us both unhappy.” THAT IS WISHFULL thinking, not “faith” in anything.
FAITH in ourselves is “John seems to be getting pleasure out of hurting me. I love him, and I am sorry and sad that he is chosing that path, and our relationship must end because he doesn’t see or care that he is hurting me, but I WILL STILL BE HAPPY WITHOUT HIM. I will still be OK.”
The “funny” (odd) thing too is that you can be both sad and happy at the same time. You can be sad that your puppy died, or any other loss, but yet over all your life, your contentment and your happiness and security need not fall apart because there is a big or a small loss of any kind in your life.
Thank you, HH, for your comments, they have given me a RENEWED RESOLVE for today to BE happy, to BE content, and to BE okay no matter what comes along. (((((hugs))))) Thank you for that affirmation!!! Love, Oxy
(Report abusive comment)
Healing Heart says:
Beautiful Oxy, Just Beautiful!!!! XXOOOO
(Report abusive comment)
kerisee04 says:
What an article. I still have the damaging names she called my husband going through my head. When she’s in a good mood, he’s a good dad, when she’s mad at him, he’s a horrible father that denies his children. He’s a selfish @$$hole, etc, etc. The funny thing is that her catch-line is “I can’t stand people who are rude or inconsiderate.” But she reserves the right to throw a expletive-filled childlike tantrum whenever the mood strikes her. I still remember how she cheated on him more times than he could count, and happily admitted to years of it after being caught, not caring about his emotions, then when he talked to me on the phone during the divorce, she threw a massive fit– he was having an ‘emotional affair’ which was ‘worse than what I (she) did.’ She threatened me, saying that I had ‘never seen the wrath of a ticked-off jealous wife’ and she ‘couldn’t wait to get her hands on’ me. But the police chose not to arrest her.
Every time she goes on a rampage, I have to stop myself from going to her door and beating the crap out of her. It’s damaging my soul, and who I am. But thank you for your article. Now I can see what’s really going on when she’s ranting and raving. She’s making outward discoveries about herself. It’s still hard to live through, though.
(Report abusive comment)
keeping_faith says:
To all, particularly James and OXY. The things you wrote have hit home for me today. I had not seen this article before. I just read it and the comments and it sums up so many things for me that I can’t even explain. I had several light bulb moments just now. It occurred to me……that, as independent and strong as I am and always have been, I became a wishful thinker……Not a victim or a blamer…. I was hoping more than I was taking action or even mentally focusing on to protect my mental well being.
I DID go to my friends and asked them to verify the things he said to me and about me and they all said, “you are strong and I have never known you to take shit from anyone. You are taking shit from him.” Still I did it anyway. I have never been accused of all he accused me of. The names he called me were incredible.
I think sometimes we have to hit bottom to get back up. I am extremely persistent. With that said, I do think our greatest strenghts ARE our greatest weaknesses. We do need to explore that. Whether it is our level of persistence, integrity, conscientiousness, reliability, etc….. whatever it is, it can hurt us if we don’t help ourselves first and truly REALIZE our weaknesses even around our strengths. I too wanted reliability in my life. Didn’t have it so much with my parents, never had it with my x husband….certainly would never see it with the XS/P boyfriend. But in the beginning he WAS the most reliable person I have ever had in my life. I DID feel that my persistence and ability to prove him wrong about me was going to make it OK. Obviously, that was not the case.
I have been having nightmares about him the last several nights. I come here and read and I feel as though you are all reading my mind and putting in writing all the same things that have happened to me and all of my thoughts.
I had one friend who protected me when I did not protect myself. The S/P called her one day, early on in our relationship when we had, what I would call, a small disagreement. The S/P behaved badly and my friend advised me then to ditch him. I didn’t listen for another year. When he called her she basically told him not to call her to talk badly about me because I am her friend. (He was telling her how crazy I was and hated his daughters and that;s why he said and did what he did and how he loves me and she should get me some help. )She didn’t buy it even then.
A year later while he was stalking me, after I had ditched him the last time/…….I went to the gym with this same friend. He saw us and walked by us, near us, around us. As soon as I walked away, he went to her and said hello and she said “get the fu*& away. You should know better.” He walked toward me ranting about how I was hurting his reputation by talking badly about him to people and telling lies, because all I have ever done is lied to him and about him……HE WAS TALKING ABOUT HIMSELF. She came to where I was and stood in front of me so I could not see him and said “ignore him and keep working out.” He left. He stalked me for a few more months, contacted me again and I basically told him he needed help and walked away. THAT’s what it means to be a good friend. I wasn’t being that to myself. I was weak when it came to him and I think I actually started to believe the nasty things he said about me. Particularly, because he would call and tell me that EVERYONE he speaks to feels the same way…….it’s hurtful and you feel like you have no one to trust or believe in you ! That stays with you for a long time.
(Report abusive comment)
muldoon says:
This is mad how I read love lies bleeding and other articles here….today he pulled what I now know is a typical antic by these evil sods..He sent me a text saying how I hurt him by throwing him out and how seperating him from the kids gave him a rotten christmas!!! cheeky sod, he stayed away and then expected to just have access when it suited him…after chasing me around the place a few days before Christmas..He is painting himself the victim..of me..
I am now able to see what is coming thanks to what I am learning here….before I didnt know what I was seeing was perfect examples of the traits…I thought it was off the cuff spur of the moment stuff..
(Report abusive comment)
alohatraveler says:
kerisee,
May I suggest you read about Borderline Personality Disorder? Your husband’s ex sounds like a carbon copy of the Bad Man. Her rules apply to him and not to her… the irony, the twisting of things.
If you haven’t read anything about BPD, you might find it right on target.
I am not a clinician but I feel a familiar tingle in my tummy when I read your lines… and of course, you will find a million more stories here that will sound oh so familiar.
Aloha
(Report abusive comment)
alohatraveler says:
Muldoon,
If you want to see me lose my mind, trip me and then claim I tripped you. Lie to me and call me THE LIAR. Abuse me, terrorize me, call me names.. and then cry like a baby and tell all your friends how terribly I have treated you.
I have written this so many times so for readers that may have seen it, I am sorry but: I spent so many sleepless nights trying to figure out how the Bad Man could work it out in his mind that he was the victim of me! This was so upsetting and perplexing.
I get it now. It’s just one of the things they do. Keep reading Muldoon. Keep reading. I absolutely love seeing you say.. OMG! WHAT IS THIS? NOW I KNOW!!!
Soon you will be able to predict his every move. The behaviors are so predictable once you see the pathology before you. It even becomes kind of boring in a weird sort of way. Oh.. now he’s telling a big crazy lie. How boring. How unoriginal. Ho hum.
)
Remember: All the terrible things he is saying about you and to you are NOT ABOUT YOU. and they are NOT WHO YOU ARE. You know who you are! And now you know who he is!
Have a wonderful day!
Aloha
(Report abusive comment)
muldoon says:
alohatravele….LIke you I used to wonder does he actually believe what he is saying of me, does he not see he is the one like that..nearly drove me around the twist. Also has sometimes driven me to launch a verbal attack of my own tthe injustice…which then had me beaten physically.
I just wish I had found this site years ago..would have saved me alot of heartache and stress…when Oxdrover said keep reading power isd knowledge, I underestimated those words but see exactly what she meant..I now understand, I see there aint no point in trying to reason or make him see.. I actually have started to not love him….something I never thought possible no matter what he did to me. Now I see it as the man I loved never existed and never will, I was conned and that makes me want to stay the hell away more than any of the abuse he has given me.
I keep saying it but I love this place!
(Report abusive comment)
muldoon says:
Question for anyone…Are narcistic folk prone to actual premediated murder? And what if they are also likely borderline? Are these people capable of killing kids or whoever or are they too worried about losing their liberty?
(Report abusive comment)
tryingtoheal says:
Lilorphan,
You are right, he did come back to harm your life, just as mine did after I thought his apology was meant! When I found myself missing the nice part of him, I told myself the truth, that there is NO nice side to him, it was all a mirage! Yes, and he called me all the names under the sun and worse .. like I was the reason I was still on my own and was too old and would never find anyone, that I was trash etc etc..
My Bad man lives locally and I caught a glimpse of him yesterday and felt my skin crawl. I have maintained the rule no contact even after he phoned my friend threatening everything he would do to me and saying how much he wanted to see me suffer, the foul messages he left on my phone, all the missed calls day and night from ‘unknown caller’ and the calls he made to the police, every week the police told me..
They are all so predictable really, I just think that it should be a madatory subject at school for education about these Bad Men and ALSO Bad Women as they are just as vile as I have experienced and continue to experience – the Bad Woman my son has got entangled with has stopped him having contact with me and my daughter and sends back any mail that I send him, threatening that if I send any more, she will take it to the police as harassment! I sent him a download from ‘tears and healing’ .. and that was her predictable response and she sent it back last week, ripped to pieces.
There is only one word to describe these ******** and that, is EVIL.
Thankfully I feel over my S now and it is all thanks to Lovefraud, I will be eternally grateful. I will never forget the S, how could anyone but the anger has faded and pity has replaced it because he can never have what we can, the ability to really love anyone and will always be alone – THAT is the price he will pay for his evilness, he hates himself, he knows what he does to others, but he would NEVER tell you THAT, its much better to project, blame and ruin someone elses life!
He used to tell me he was UNIQUE, that I would never find another MAN like HIM! … wonder if he’s heard of Lovefraud.. !!
How I wish I could tell the next good woman he has his sights on …
Muldoon,
I feel the answer to your question is yes. They plot scheme and plan and premeditate everything they do, that is their warped idea of fun! They think they are much more clever than anyone else and think they can talk their way in and out of anything. They like to frighten and scare people and threaten, they get their kicks that way, they think they’re omnipotent!
Most make empty threats but Do tell someone if you are worried, go with your gut feeling, even if it turns out to be an empty threat, better being SAFE.
(Report abusive comment)
tryingtoheal says:
Muldoon,
Have you thought about a possible Injunction? It may deter, although these ‘people’ mainly see it as just a piece of paper, I remember my S saying that he had one to stop him from going anywhere near the school his children attended.. – this was all part of his pity play, that he loved his boys, his ex was mad.. and so on.. which he backed up with papers – forged for the purpose, no doubt! .. but to my knowledge he never went to the school.
(Report abusive comment)
Elizabeth Conley says:
muldoon,
Borderline + Narcissistic?
I dunno what he’ll do.
Here’s the thing. Not many guys do that. It’s just that when they do, the incident hits the headlines and we all take notice.
Your X is a bit more bonzo than most. You should be more careful about security for a long time to come. You should also document all his nasty, squirrelly, and aggressive behaviors. Anything you can get to prove he’s a risk, you need to have ready to present when custody and visitation become the issue.
If he gets unsupervised visitation, you would be smart to have him pick up and drop off the kids at the local police station.
I guess what I’m rambling on about is:
1. You can’t predict the future.
2. You can take reasonable precautions.
3. You’re more likely to lose a child to a car accident than to premeditated murder.
Getting away from him was really smart. Stay away. Do everything in your power to keep necessary interactions calm. Recognize that your most dangerous period is right now. As you separate and go through the divorce and custody agreement issues, he’s going to become very, very angry. Your biggest risk period is now ’til a year or three after the divorce. After that, you can relax a bit. The cooler and more distant you are, the less likely it is that violence will erupt.
Document, document, document. Your X doesn’t sound in the least bit discrete. You may be able to catch him in enough to make a difference when the custody hearing comes around.
(Report abusive comment)
tryingtoheal says:
Aloha,
I LoVE your blogs! How ‘on target’ you are, i so agree that they get soooooo boring. We have all searched our minds as to whether they actually believe what they’re saying, turned our minds inside out trying to puzzle it out, what a waste of our energy, of course they don’t believe it, they say it for one reason only – THEIR WARPED PLEASURE – TO SEE US SQUIRM!
(Report abusive comment)
kerisee04 says:
Aloha–
Yes, she is Borderline Personality. In fact, she’s been diagnosed twice with it. I have trouble distinguishing between that and sociopathy, though, because many times, she seems even worse than BPD. I think the last psychologist wanted to give her a perjorative diagnosis because she was doing an evaluation for our custody dispute and only saw her twice. I don’t know. Either way, she’s a complete mess and likes to unload on my husband.
Would you mind if I called her “The Bad Woman?” I hate always saying, “my husband’s ex…” Seems easier. She doesn’t have any real remorse, only completely fake remorse. “I know I did things that were wrong, but I wouldn’t have done them if you hadn’t…” blah, blah, blah. She doesn’t have any capacity for love or empathy. She views everybody for what they can do for her. For instance, she only pretended to be my friend because she wanted my ex-husband. She tried to trap my now-husband by getting pregnant during their divorce. He still left her, but it left a path of destruction for him and me. And now a poor child is born whose original purpose was simply to be a trap. (That was his fault too, but we all know how manipulative these people can be, especially to people who’ve been spell-bound by them for years.)
The only respite we have is when she’s obsessed with a new man. Then she leaves us alone. But every time that falls through, she’s back to harassing my husband, coming around his work, calling for “parenting advice,” wanting child support even before he’s late. If she had the chance, she’d take him back in a heartbeat. The REAL reason would be because he can provide for her. Her OUTWARD reason would be, “get back together for the kids, even though I hate you.” But she would conveniently forget about all the dozens of times she cheated on him throughout their marriage, and didn’t even fess up to them until she got caught. She didn’t even need to confess to all of it. But it’s like she took some sick pleasure in sharing her dirty secret. “Look what I got away with for 6 1/2 years” mentality. Of course, she would make him feel like he hurt her worse by having an ‘emotional affair’ with me during their divorce. These people have such twisted ways of thinking.
I have stopped obsessing to our family, because they thought I was the one with the problem. Of course, they don’t have to deal with her roller coaster of emotions, they don’t have to deal with what she does to the kids every week. They don’t have to deal with her accusations or manipulations. They’re amazed at my ‘new’ attitude toward her. How well I’m dealing with her now. Well, I am dealing better. I have decided she can’t be allowed to affect my life the way I had been letting her. Doesn’t change how repulsed I am by her and her whore-ish ways. The worry I have for the kids, and the fear of dealing with her one-on-one. I fear that because she has a way of getting information from me. I am naturally a nice person. I try not to make problems. She uses that, of course. So I make my husband deal with her. But then I worry about what she’s saying to him because I’m not there. And is she saying stuff that he’s not telling me about? He might be trying to shield me from her comments because he knows they hurt me.
Sorry, I’m writing a book here. I do feel like I’m getting better, but sometimes I just need to vent a bit, I guess. And sometimes I feel victimized again by family because they just don’t understand. Then I feel like maybe there really is something wrong with me. Why doesn’t anybody take my side? But disordered people have a way of making others think it’s impossible for them to be as bad as they really are. My husband’s sister still questions whether or not the bad woman molested my stepson. If you knew what the 4 year old said about sex, the female genitalia, and what he told the therapist about what his mom did, there would be no question. But you’d never think she’d be capable of it by looking at her. That’s where they have power over people. The judge didn’t even believe it! He’s such an idiot. Undereducated, and completely snowed by her. Anyway, I’m sorry folks. Kudos to you if you made it through my rant!
(Report abusive comment)
OxDrover says:
Dear Muldoon, and all,
Yes, a BPD CAN act under some circumstances like a psychopath, there is an ARTICLE HERE somewhere I am not sure where it is and don’t have time to search for it, but maybe someone can remember the exact name for it, but YES, BPDs can and do KILL just as PPDs can and do.
Under stress a BPD is I think can be JUST AS DANGEROUS as a P. I worked with the BPD kids (mostly girls) in an inpatient setting and I have seen them actually try to do grave physical harm (stabbing) to others (once ot me) and then five minutes later after the crisis was over, still want to be “best friends” with the actual or potential victim of their rage. It was creepy when one of these kids would try to stab me and then five minutes later, pretend that none of the earlier violence had happened. Sheesh, is that EVER CREEPY.
After the last attempt at stabbing BARELY failed and I survived, I decided it was God’s way of telling me that “I needed to find a new job!”
Of course not all BPDs are physically dangerous, as not all Ps are physically dangerous, but NO RELATIONSHIP with these people is without DRAMA and DANGER of some sort, and at the very least is detrimental to anyone having to associate with them.
I think it is just a good idea to be WARY of anyone with that diagnosis or suspected diagnosis. (i.e. “If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck” treat it like a duck) LOL
(Report abusive comment)
keeping_faith says:
I wonder if the XS/P has BPD. After one session with a counselor he told me he and the counselor diagnosed me. i told him he needed to find a new counselor.
He exemplified projection. I recall when he said this to me I actually got on line to look it up and realized he may have been talking about himself.So I asked my therapist if there is something wrong with me and if I had BPD and he laughed. He said “classic projection”.
(Report abusive comment)
onajourney says:
Thank you Aloha for this post.
My daughter is married to a p. He called her demeaning names and I stuck up for her (in July). I couldn’t believe she would let him speak to her like that. I couldn’t believe she wouldn’t say something. She made excuses for him. She still must be “in the fog”. I hope and pray she wakes up.
When I read the posts here, my overwhelming emotion is joy that you all are out of the grip of a p/s/n!!!
(Report abusive comment)
Matt says:
Aloha:
I’m going to have to read the Romeo’s Bleeding series.
My ex-S was a particular nasty piece of work. He used to tell me that I drove people away. In a way, S was right. By the end, a lot of people in my life were gone, because they couldn’t stand listening to my obsessing about S.
But, my friends are coming back — now that the S is gone. S, on the other hand, has few friends — he has burned so many people his dance card looks pretty sparse.
And the friends who have come back have, without my having to ask them, brought up what they consider my fine qualities. Good for rebuilding my shattered self-esteem.
(Report abusive comment)
James says:
I really enjoy reading Romeo’s Bleeding and have read it more then once. Of course when I read it I see “Juliet’s Bleeding”. But this part really hits home for me. For I know it to be true….
I always felt this to be the reason my ex S/P was attracted to me. And now after all the years knowing her I understand just how much she lack both integrity and conscientiousness even to this day…
For indeed:
“Integrity and conscientiousness remind Controllers of their most profound character flaw. They hate being reminded of what they do not have. They hate those qualities in others because Controllers cannot possess them. That is one reason that they are attracted to integrity. But their attraction is rooted in a desire to dominate or destroy. They must manipulate, rule or emotionally and psychologically annihilate anyone whose soundness of character reminds them of their own profoundly egotistical, selfish and empty natures.”
(Report abusive comment)