Might there be physical consequences to life with a psychopath?
PDF Several readers of Lovefraud have mentioned medical problems that arose in their lives with psychopaths. These readers are convinced that the psychological stress and pain of these relationships translated themselves into physical ailments. Some of these symptoms disappeared when the psychopath disappeared, some didn’t. Here are a few recent comments:
When I parted from him, physically I felt so raw and sore, I looked like I had been in a boxing ring. My health was poor and I couldnt even have the osteopath touch me, I said I felt like I had been stabbed all over. All though he never laid a finger on me, he gave me plenty of mental and emotional abuse.
I have a feeling its 2 years of being TIRED and worn to a pulp emotionally by his wordy games.
sleep loss is another big thing ive experienced since this s path during and after i still have trouble sometimes sleeping, like my mind will not shut off. and during being with the s apth i was trying to work out what the hell was going on and trying to work things ou in my head stopped me from sleeping well. which makes your head even more clouded.
Talking about physical consequences of being around bad stuff for seven years in my case, I don’t know if this applies but there is one thing that makes me think is the fact that my blood pressure got so much better. I used to have high blood pressure during the last four years with him. Since I left him for almost six months I don’t even need to take medication and I’m sleeping so much better these days.
Anytime we are trying to fix someone else, we are off track. I just work on me now. If I see someone other than me that needs work… I feel TIRED. No can do!
Dr. Steve: I would so much appreciate a forthcoming post about physical consequences or PTSD of an association with a Sociopath. Nearly 5 months hence, and past the “why” and figuring out the “puzzle” (identifying him as a sociopath and doing intensive investigation/research as to who he really is and what he has done), there is still a lot of emotional pain
Have you noticed anything similar? How do you understand/make sense of this ‘translation’? Have you managed to deal with such an ailment or overcome it? How exactly
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In future posts I will write more on the interaction between experience, the mind, and the body. I will present some ideas of how/why it is that a interpersonal situation can have bad effects not only on one’s mind but on one’s body. Also, I will introduce some exciting research on what you can do to help repair the damage psychological distress mave have contributed to your body.
jules says:
chANGE 06.it wasnt my birthday the day we got the pizza it was a week later. but i hear you . he did work while he lived with me held down a good job money wasnt his problem he is not like most s paths in this regard . he is still working and living alone paying his way i know this for a fact. when we split he lived with his mum for a while but complained cause he had no privacy but i know he meant i cant bring woman around and do what i want. i know i have to think aobut me, i am trying but its just this torture. one good thing happened to day which lifted my mood a bit. one of the dating sites im on a nice guy has replied to me and we chatted on the phone he seemed nice and he is moving to near where i live this weekend. so even if nothing happens he might be a nice freind to have and get my mind off the s path. i think its the not knowing what hes up to that gets me. so many of the people on here seem to know what there ex is doing but i have no clue, and he makes sure i dont. i just hope he feels empty really thats what i want i know he is hurting from the last girl dumping him, thats making him play up all the more. it does feel good to me to know she hurt him he deserves it.i ts like he is filling up a hole inside him with the sex and the manipulations but when he doesnt get what he wants or things dont go his way he becomes angry and wants to hurt people. does any one else see this in the s paths. i really want to meet someone nice settle down and have a baby thats what i want and what i always wanted, and i want to stick it to him and say see im happy and im loved, and hopefully he wont be. thanks for all advice and i know im not alone we are feeling the same stuff.
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change06 says:
I am glad to hear you had your spirits lifted. Stop worried about not knowing what he is doing. No one on this site really knows what their ex’s are doing. They may no about them a bit but they dont know what they are up to….and never did and never will. Liars, Manipulators, Cheaters, Decietful, Coniving….REMEMBER.
And I dont think your guy is hurt at all over the other girl….it is all an act. That too is a lie. They dont feel hurt..ever. If it seems like they are hurt, loving, sweet it is all an ACT!! So, dont think about what he is doing and that he might be hurting or one day will be hurting…cause he wont!
Just think about how you were hurt from this..and still are. Do positive things for yourself and force yourself to do anything that will push anything about him out of your mind. It is torture but we have to build ourselves back up from this. Therefore, you will be truly open and ready for that person in which you will be happy, in love and have a family with.
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notquitebroken says:
Jules, I’m so sorry you’re struggling like this. I can certainly relate to all your troubles with the spath. I stupidly picked up my cell phone without looking at the number calling this weekend and spoke with mine very briefly. He asked how I was doing, and I brightly said, “Really great, and I hope you’re doing well, too. I can’t talk right now, but take care of yourself!” and hung up. I wish I hadn’t heard his voice at all because it makes me miss him more, but I seem to have driven him nuts. That extremely brief conversation started a flurry of messages from him by text. “I’m glad you’re doing well without me. It’s good to see I haven’t had a devastating effect on you,” was the first one. I ignored it because I knew he was trying to imply that I didn’t care by saying those things. He was trying to get a reaction. He then sent me another message. “Are you dating someone these days?” and I didn’t reply. A couple of hours later he sent another. “You must be seeing someone and don’t want him to know about me.” I thought to myself, no that would be the sort of thing YOU’D do, you would lie to someone about who you’re seeing. I don’t do that sorta thing. I’m alone. And being all alone beats the hell out of letting him hurt me over and over and over again. Being lonely to begin with made me vulnerable to his machinations, but it ROCKED in comparison to the suffering he put me through. If that’s love (and I know it isn’t), I’d much rather be lonely. He sent another message later saying, “It really hurts me to know that you care so little about what we had.” Still trying to get a reaction. A few hours later, another saying “I was so wrong about the type of caring person I thought you were.”
It’s so hard not to respond. It’s hard not to reassure him that he meant the entire world to me because I’m a good, caring person and he knows that I’ve always needed to do the right thing, to care, to see the best in everyone. It’s hard not to respond with an angry reaction that I am indeed VERY caring, but HE’S the one who failed. The thing is, he’s NOT going to get the response he wants so badly. If I say something back to him, the only thing he’ll understand is that he hooked me again. The only thing he’ll get is that he’s still got power over me. Well, he doesn’t. He has no more power over me. I keep saying it over and over to myself. I have power over myself. I have power over myself.
You know what dawned on me this weekend? A big part of the reason I fell for him wasn’t that I was so terribly in love, even. It was that I just plain didn’t want to be this spectacularly WRONG about someone. I stayed and was determined to make this thing work because I didn’t want to admit failure, and he preyed on that. I didn’t want to have to admit to friends and family who had warned me that I was as wrong as I could possibly have been about him. I felt stupid enough on my own, so I kept the whole show running in an effort to prove I was right. I tried to get him to prove I was right, too. A decent guy would have gone out of his way to prove that he was good and kind, but I let him put that burden of proof ON ME. I was the one who had to prove he was great instead of letting him fail in due time and just walking away. It was my own damned pride that tripped me up in the first place! So I’m trying to admit that I hosed this one up BADLY. I’m trying to deal with the notion that I was utterly and completely WRONG and learn from that mistake. Pride goeth before a fall, and hooboy did I fall on my ass with this one! HE FAILS. He fails at being a good person. I did my best, and if he were a decent human being, we could have had something beautiful, but he’s not. I made every effort, and I can take pride in being a love, caring person, but I can also admit when I am wrong, and I certainly was.
Don’t they say that the first step in recovery is admitting you have a problem? Well, here I am. I’m admitting I have a problem with being wrong. I don’t like to be wrong. I’m a smart woman who is accustomed to being right most of the time. I had to let go of being RIGHT about this guy and deal with the fact that I’m human, too. I made some big mistakes. But you know what? I’d sure as hell rather be human than a monster like him.
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righteous woman says:
Inspiration to all bloggers – and especially Jules last post:
“The best revenge is living well…”
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distraught says:
notquitebroken: how right you are. Every fiber of my being wants to keep sending e-mails telling this jerk where to get off–that I understand his game and now I’m stronger and wiser. I won’t because, you’re right, that just gives them what they want. That gives them satisfaction. I am thinking back over the months and months of wasted words and emotions. I wanted to understand him, I wanted to believe all his lies, I wanted confirmation that I wasn’t wrong about him. How could a smart, wise woman be so wrong? How could I fall for his lies? I thought I was better than that. This has been humbling more than anything for me. Pride does goeth before a fall! Huge lesson learned! Thanks for your post.
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change06 says:
WOW! notquitebroken so well said indeed! You hit the nail on the head and by the simple words of admitting you were wrong on this one!-GREAT I feel the same, it has been hard to except that I messed up, (well he did) but I couldn’t see the forest from the trees. And when you say HE FAILS at being a good person-Love it! You have captured such tremendous strength with not responding to his emails. I am not there yet, I think if he did send all the emails I would be hooked thinking he was trying to do right. It would be so easy for him! I can’t wait till I am were you are in healing. BRAVO
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EnnLondon says:
Oh notquitebroken: God they use these phrases like keyboard shortcuts don’t they? ‘you care so little about what we had.’ ACTOR! Who, who isn’t in a crap soap, uses language like that? (Oh I know – a sociopath!)
Good on you though for bringing out that sort of panicky obsessive irritation that seems for them to be the nearest they get to being hurt. Too bad you had to speak to him – but your response was perfect!
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righteous woman says:
Gillian,
Thanks sweetheart – you made me feel like a million bucks..I read your post and it was like I wrote it..I have made all the same attempts to make him see reason, and it was a waste of my time too. My son feels the same apathy towards his father. As I read your post, I got three back to back calls from him…Answer them? I don’t even care what he has to say. He is no better than a telemarketer..trying to convince me to buy something I don’t want.
I think we have comparable stories – same amount of time invested, hoping for the best for our children’s’ sake, and this was the man I loved with all my heart at one time. I gave him Chance after chance….
I am moving out of state and FINALLY buying a home after my son graduates high-school and to be near my best friend and her family. My son will go to the local university and I will have a house to fix up, a new business, and all of the things to keep me busy that my current local culture can’t offer me…(cost of living is a killer here). When I leave the state, there will be no contact – AT ALL. Back Child support will be ‘either he pays or doesn’t pay’ The DAs office will be monitoring that. I will be done on any level – trying to prove he is a liar under any circumstance. He will have the same value to me as the boy I dated before him. No interest, no concern.
I have healed so much – but still feel the wound. “phantom pain” But it gets easier every time I don’t get sucked into his games. I feel more powerful everyday, like I am coming out of the fog.
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jules says:
not quiet brkn: thank you and i have the same experience. sometimes i feel stronger than others. he used to contact me like that too panicking mostly if something went wrong for him like he got dumped or something. but not so much now he rarely calls. yeh it s the lonlines that makes me feel vulnerable. and i was like you too i thought i had picked this great guy and it s hard to accept we were wrong but i know i was. i was talking to a girl at work today and she has trouble with her ex hubby he sounds like a s path and hes playing games using her kids to manipulate and hurt her. his new wife is also in on it i felt so sorry and thought thank god i have no kids with s path ex. i actually found it helpful listening to her and i gave her advice . its helping me too though. i am learning about the nature of these beasts and i think that is why mine ex leaves me alone more now cause i know what hes like and what its all about the chalenge of fooling me isnt there so hes doing this to other girls he can hoodwink. what you said in that phone call was great i love it. i should b e more like you instead of giving in on a weak moment of lonliness. one good thing when he sent the message saying we ll get to gether another time, i did not send a reply i just left it . so now i hope that gets him going a bit nuts too. i ts like i think now hes got me on stand by for when the other girls dont take his bait or figure out somethings not right. then he calls me and puts on the charm. once he rang me at work after not hearing from him for ages and hes like hi baby, as if we were still together. but i was seeing someone else. i was like who is this, he didnt like that i acted like i didnt know who it was. and yes mine too lies about seeing people. i feel like we are all connected having this stuff go on in our life, you guys help me so much. righteous woman: i totally relate to your living situation where i live is very expensive area and i would like to take time to heal and have a bit more balance in my life but i have to work so hard to live here i cant i just have to keep going to work even when i feel so bad some days. my parents live in this area too so i want to be near them but its getting hard financially. also the s path lives not far away too .good on you for moving away. every day is a struggle in more than one way for me at the moment. but the people i work with are nice and we have a laugh it takes my mind off things.which is good i guess. not quiet broken; i think your s path is very like my ex he even says the. same things. when mine calls out of the blue he says that all innocent, hey how are you doing. like he really cares., not. …………. feel free to coment and thanks for what you wrote .
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justme says:
It wasn’t too long ago that I finally figured out that my physical ailments and mental breakdown has been caused by my sociopathic sister and her daughter.
For that last 2 years I have been trying to find my way back to my life and it has been so painful to realize all that I have lost because of them. I lost my friends, my job, my self respect, my dignity as my niece campaigned against me in such vicous ways that without a full on Supreme court declaration that everything she says is a lie on top of a lie it will be nearly impossible for me to regain any respect from anyone.
They are so good at what they do that it is a fruitless if not dangerous endeavor to even attempt to defend yourself.
I think that if I had been married with someone who could point all this out to me they wouldn’t have been able to take over my life and destroy me as they have. I was defenseless against them, I had no one to support me and still don’t. I have to rely on me and me alone.
Within 2 years of moving my niece, her brother and my mother (a possible sociopath herself) into my home and doing what I thought was the right thing to do, my physical well being went down the tubes. It first started in my neck and then found it’s way to my lower back, I was literally having my life sucked right out from under me. It got to the point of barely being able to move, the pain was so severe that I could no longer work, I couldn’t do anything except sleep or lay down.
Depression and pain replaced my joy and happiness, isolation replaced activity. I have barely left my house in 7 years I have become the physical representation of their craziness.
The mind games never stop, I have had to force myself to say NO, to stop them from coming to my home (where my nephew still lives with me) to not see them. There is a new life now and my sister has moved onto this little fella…she will ruin every birthday,every Christmas, every holiday no matter what. OH that’s right he just had his 1 year birthday and she ruined it right on cue.
I am planning on moving as soon as possible as distance is the only answer, I can’t wait till my nephew graduates from high school, I will be packed and ready to go. He has his mother’s tendancies, only he is so bright and truly wants to change…don’t know if he will succeed, I sure hope so as he has so much to offer this world.
My life has been irreparably damaged, how I allowed my sister to ruin my life is beyond me. I am an educated woman who had so much going for her and now all I can do is pick up the pieces of my broken life and find some peace somewhere far far away from her. I stopped loving her years ago, I suppose there was some sympathy masquerading as Love due to our horrible unbringing. But I suddenly realized one day that I too was brought up in the same lousy house with the same lousy parent’s she was and I manged to make something of myself and there was no reason she couldn’t as well.
I hate them all, my whole family for expecting so much of me for allowing my niece to bad mouth me and doing nothing to stop it. For not seeing that asking me to take them all in and solve their problems as if I was their mother and father or as if I was responsible for them was TOO MUCH to ask. I hate them for taking advantage of my good nature, for jading me against Love in general, for stealing my joy, my happiness, my diginty, my respect, my job, my friends.
I am making plans to remove each and everyone of them from my life, they won’t know what hit them. I fantasize everyday about how my life will be and right now I’m pretty darn sure it’s going to be great.
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tryingtorecover says:
righteouswoman,
I loved the quote “Always remember, any type of communication is based on a lie, and is only to fulfill some purpose for him.” too. But, “He is no better than a telemarketer..trying to convince me to buy something I don’t want.” made me smile. It’s going to help the next time he leaves a vm (I refuse to talk to him on the phone) or tm me. He’s like a used car salesman and I can see right through him.
Feeling empowered is so important for me right now. Thanks.
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Beverly says:
Yes Jules, I relate to your comments here as well. I still periodically check up on my ex. I had no closure, and he kept most of what he did secret, and even at the end he chose to let me in on what he was doing, and then he did a runner and refused to speak to me ever and sent round a family member to tell me that if I contacted him again he would have me done for harrassment – THE CHEEK OF IT.
I have a morbid interest to know what he is doing and I think that is natural given the circumstances of someone who is so secretive. Also my ex has a new one and of course I am curious about her. But I just know that in the end it really doesnt matter, because I know he just wont be able to lead a normal relationship, he wil manipulate and sabotage it, and who knows this time, his current partner might have a big burly brother who will knock his block off. I feel mad too at times, feel like I have been robbed. In comparison to what some people on this site have suffered, my short relationship was miniscule in comparison.
I suspected alot of stuff about my exN, but despite checking on him, I couldnt find out anything, so like you, I can only imagine what he may have been up to. sometimes, I am pleased to not know Jules.
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phoenix says:
I can so identify with Swallow on most (if not ALL symptoms) once I went NC.
Its been 1 year and 3 months of NC – and I’m Soooooooo much better. Just today I had a MAJOR breakthrough…and I finally have hope and excitement about the future (That I’m alive and back in te land of the Living)
It wasn’t easy – Places like this and others experiences helped immensley.
But TIME..and working it through in my mind..Over and Over with the passing of time, brought NEW awareness to the R/Ship and everything that transpired.
I surely didnt ASK for this experience, and would NOT want to go through any thing like it again… But I’m sooo glad I’m coming out.
My heart goes out to my friends that I have met, who still struggle. We’ll make it…. Keep on going on !!!
BetterOff
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mensuck says:
hello….i have read blog after blog and feel comfort knowing that i am not alone….after doing alot of soul searching and research i have come to realize that i have fallen for the socipathic men several times….this last time was a doozie….i had a son with him and boy has my life changed…there is never a day that can go by that is peaceful/happy….W always seems to manage to enter our lives when ever he feels like it, damage it peice by peice – word by word – rage by rage – control by control etc…it is almost as if i am going crazy…as a matter of fact that is what he calls me, his x-wife and all of his x-girlfriends….to make matters worse, i work with him ….talk about a glutten for punishment….(it is daily sadness/on your toes/un-orgainzed/craziness/ raging/ disrespect and unsafe conditions) i worked for him for 8 years and then broke it off with him while i was pregnant because he could/would not stay out of the strip clubs and had another girlfriend so i ended up quitting – had already has his new girlfriend working there without my knowledge….after 3 years went by he asked me to come back to help his distroyed business -because of that stripper & her friends he was involed with ruined him….i came back to save/help him…stupid me….it is funny how the sociopath makes you feel mad at him for one secound and then he makes you feel sorry for him the next….so here i am miserable coming to work everyday knowing that i am wrong…but do it so i can keep tabs on what he is doing to desperatetly try to protect my 5 year old son and of course for the money….it sounds nuts and it makes me crazy but somehow through it all i feel a sence of comfort….as sick as that sounds….it is the truth….i have recently gotten to know his x-wife very well ….we both have shared stories and lived life with this very toxic man….we are inseperatable now and have this strange bond from the aftermath of W….in my opinon we both are still being controlled one way or another…..he comes into our homes-walks right in-even invites others (like the new girlfriend & kids) to walk right in without permission, grabs a drink, rumages through paperwork when you are in the other room, checks the phones / personal belongings and is constantly looking around and questioning…..it is like a life sentence for the both of us….we both have sons with him and that it extremely hard to stay away from him….my question is for all HOW DO YOU LIVE A NORMAL LIFE WHEN YOU HAVE A CHILD WITH A SOCIOPATH? does anyone have any suggestions, ideas, helpful hints? he puts myself in danger as well as my son in danger, lets him and another two 6 & 7 year children walk to the local park alone, takes him on boats w/no life jacket, talks on his cell 24/7 ignoring my son and what is around him, picks him up every other weekend to torchure me -picks him up late, drops him off late-whatever is convient for him of course-changes days with no notice, his taste in new woman have been strippers which is one after another-he even brings them around my son and has “sleep overs”, he lets my son sleep in the bed w/both of them, rages over the phone, allows my son in the internet you tube, watches bad movies in front of him – man show….it is endless and exhausting….how can one woman work, maintain the house, take care of a child alone (and make up for his unablity as a parent) and a have a personal life???? i have not dated in over a year for fear that i might attract yet another sociopath…..i too like most on here have cronic pain in my neck, gained a massive amount of weight, stay at home alot, have depression and tons of anixiety….i guess these are the side effects of being around a sociopath???
-desperate to have a normal happy life again D
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nottakingitanymore says:
I was married for many years to a sociopath. I started having migraines that made me vomit. They became more frequent as time went on. Since separating from him in 2005, I have only had one and it was associated with having to deal with him through the legal system.
For all of you who are dealing with something like this, I want to tell you that I am now very strong and healthy. You can be, too. I go to the gym and work out. I look better and I feel better. I attribute a lot of this to the fact that I have cut the sociopath out of my life as much as I possibly can. I still have to deal with him a little because of remaining legal issues and because we had children together, but I minimize contact and keep conversations short. I do not think about him or wish that things could have been different or think that I should have tried something else.
During our marriage I tried everything I could think of and read lots of advice books and kept thinking that I just hadn’t found the right way to deal with him and that maybe there was something wrong with me. Now I realize that there was NO WAY to deal with him except by cutting off contact with him.
So, if you are dealing with a sociopath, my advice is 1) cut this person out of your life as much as you possibly can. 2) Don’t waste any more time thinking about him. (I think It’s ok to mourn for the lost part of your life. I think if you don’t do this, you are in denial. Just don’t wallow in it forever. Admit both the good things and the bad things, but realize that it can never be the way you imagined it would. It can never be normal or healthy to stay with him. Then move on.) 3) Forgive yourself for being “stupid” enough to fall for him. You aren’t stupid. You are most likely naive and innocent and not the type of person who could imagine someone behaving as manipulatively and sadistically as your sociopath did. 4) Take responsibility for your own future. Don’t let any aspect of it depend on him or revolve around him. Take control of your own life. Don’t wait for him or anyone else to “rescue” you. Don’t think he will ever “see the light” or apologize or anything like that. He is not capable of it unless it is just a ploy to suck you back into his life. If he apologizes, he does not mean it. He will say whatever he has to to get what he wants. 5) Exercise and eat properly. 6) Reconnect with your family and friends. Make new friends. Surround yourself with good people who care about you and are not trying to use you. 7) Know that you deserve to have a good and happy life. You didn’t deserve to be mistreated by the sociopath or trapped in a relationship with him.
Know that things can get better, physically and emotionally, and that you can stop feeling so miserable. I firmly believe that this WILL happen if you do all the things on this list.
I just want to say that I am so happy in my life right now. I have a great job. I have great friends, both old and new. My family was not too supportive during the separation, (because they didn’t understand) but things are good with them now. My children, who the sociopath alienated from me, are beginning to realize the truth. (and not because I badmouth him. They are seeing it on their own.)
They say the best revenge is living well. That may be true. But the best part of living well is not the revenge – I’m far past that. The best part of living well is that it feels so good!
You’re all in my prayers. I wish you all much happiness and a great future.
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mensuck says:
thank you so much nottakingitanymore (btw – i love that title you have ) i do know that i DO NOT want to ever be with him or have things the way they used to be EVER between us…so that is the first step….he still has alot of anger towards me for leaving him and quiting the job-every time he breaks up with his girlfriends just who do you think he runs to for help….well not anymore since i told him NO not ever…i wish he would stop taking my child because day by day i see a liitle mini W…how do you stop that or control that from happening…it is comforting to know that your children see what is really going on…i am sure that it was a battle for you….my son is really confused about who is right /wrong…who all the woman are….who is good person/bad person….but i have noticed at the mear age of 5 he is picking up on dad’s bad behaviors and learning from me that he is wrong….it seems like years worth of exhausting days….i am trying to pull myself up and out of depression and hopefully i will one day soon…i also understand why friends/family where not there because the same thing happened to me when i had to battle him in mediation…(the x wife had to do the same-year after year)….there seems to be no end to the wrath of a sociopath…you are right about staying away and having very few conversations BUT how do you do that when he takes your son away for the weekend? every other weekend the week before i am sick to my stomach, the anixety hits and i am a wreck thinking what is going to happen to my poor child this time….if he is mad at me-he wont let me talk to my son-he is very vendictive and will get even with me….my poor child comes home exhausted from lack of sleep, lack of food, lack of nutrition and water….his clothes are small and he looks like a rag a muffin…..his father lives in a million dollar house and lets his son walk around like a hobo….it is very fustrating…have you ever taken your children to therapy because of dad? i guess day by day i will try to get stronger and come up with a plan to change my life….thanks again for your response
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pokeybanana says:
I’ve been in therapy since October 2007 when I discovered the lies and betrayals from my ex, a true sociopath. In fact, his betrayal hit so low, it actually made me feel suicidal, although, thankfully, I never attempted to take my own life. I was able to focus on my 10-year-old daughter, who lost her father in April 2006, so I knew I could never hurt her by hurting myself.
Sorry to digress…
Anyway, in therapy, some “interesting” things have come to life that have made me aware of why I have accepted certain things from men. My father, an alcoholic and gambler, left when I was a young girl but always promised to come right back. In fact, he made repeated “promises” that never came true. Some of you may be able to relate to this thinking — don’t air dirty laundry in public. Well, that was my mother’s mantra. She kept facts from us because she wanted my sister and me to always love my father and she thought if we knew the truth, we wouldn’t love him anymore. Then, as an adult, it finally dawned on me that my favorite aunt had been repeatedly beaten by my uncle. Again, back then, domestic violence was not well known and it was kept hidden.
So, my therapist has helped me to understand that keeping secrets is normal to me. Therefore, when my ex kept his own little secrets, although it annoyed me and I THOUGHT something was wrong, it FELT totally NORMAL to me. And, his constant threats of breaking up with me would trigger my fears of abandonment, which turned me into a needy, clingy bitch.
How did this affect me physically? I gained and lost weight; I had temper tantrums; my PMS became extreme; I felt like I was slowly losing my mind. I suffered from insomnia, which made me late to work. My irritable bowel syndrome was reactivated, and I developed acid reflux. At one point, I developed shingles.
But, my therapist has helped me to see that it wasn’t only my ex who played on my childhood baggage. Even at work, I felt the need to “please,” to make people happy. That led me to take on more work than I really could handle, which only increased my stess levels. And I worked for a Scientologist, who, when he discovered that I was in therapy, ended up finding a reason to terminate my employment in January.
I am thankful for my therapy, and despite no longer having insurance, I am continuing the therapy to the best of my ability. But, I wonder if anyone else has that “need to please” “disorder” (for lack of a better word) that might make them vulnerable to people? Because of my fear of abandonment, I have never developed internal boundaries or had the strength to walk away when I felt someone had crossed a particular line. I am trying to develop those boundaries and working on my own internal confidence that recognizes that someone who does cross such lines is not someone I need in my life. Not easy.
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righteous woman says:
My sociopath insisted that I tell my son to respect him. Despite not picking him up on time or at all. Not bringing his son to his own birthday parties where 20 children are waiting and not answering the phone to tell me what is going on. Never getting him a Christmas present, and birthday presents ONLY happened when trying to get on MY good side. And these are some highlights…The story of parental neglect abandonment and abuse would be too much for what I want to convey with this. Needless to say, this man did few and far between good things with only the purpose to gain my favor, seduce me, or manipulate a situation to his benefit.
Excuse me. But this person, who happens to be my sons father, has a serious character flaw. DNA is no excuse for poor behavior. It is just not. Do I want to send my son out into the world to be victimized by a lover, a boss, a friend? NO. If I had a daughter, it would be the same answer, NO. Our children learn how to treat the people they meet in the world, and themselves AT HOME.
I loved my mother dearly, and she didn’t recognize what was going on in its entirety. But I was set up to accept the behavior that ended up plaguing my life for years. Are we going to perpetuate this brutal reality that happened to us onto our children? I see a theme in a lot of the posts lately. Alchoholic, verbally abusive, narcissistic father, door-mat for a mother(my mother even self proclaimed herself a door-mat, but the eventual divorce only changed the way she was abused). I wasn’t going to let that happen to my son. How is that fair to them? Isn’t their happiness and self esteem most important? I am sorry, but the thought of my child being treated like I was, brings tears to my eyes…. Parental alienation just doesn’t apply to these situations when character building, and being able to identify people with flawed characters appropriately. Set boundaries. Enforce them…The sociopath disappears…problem solved for all of you (with children).
I am sorry if I am off topic, but I was getting something out of the previous blogs I just had to address.
Have a good night…
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Bé says:
Righteous woman,
I agree with you. I can also so relate to Tami and what the previous writer said. Swallow, I also had depression and severe panic attacks, although after his death I had no depression or any panick attacks. In fact everyone who has known me for the past 10 years say that I haven’t looked better in all this time. I haven’t again felt as tired as I did when he was alive. People who know me say they can’t believe I’m the same person. So don’t loose hope. There is a wonderful life without a psycho/narcissist.
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tryingtorecover says:
righteous woman,
I am struggling with this right now. My mother was a door mat and my father was an alcoholic and verbally abusive. That’s where I learned to tolerate my ex’s behavior. Let me tell you of one story that I am still trying to forgive myself for. When my son was around 6 or so (he’s 14 now) the three of us were getting in the car in the Home Depot parking lot. My son was on the driver’s side with Bad Dad and all of a sudden he got in and was pulling out and my son was still standing there. He left a 6 yr old in the middle of a busy parking lot not knowing if his parents were coming back. As he’s pulling away and I realized my son wasn’t in the car, I started panicking and saying what are you doing?! Go back! Go back! Go back! I didn’t know if he was going to. Apparently my son didn’t want to get in so he thought he’d teach him a lesson. (He did it in a fit of rage.) He said I can see him he’s fine and he drove around and picked him up. When I asked what he was thinking and how could he do that – he could have been hit by a car or God knows what, he said he was never in any danger and he got mad at me for being outraged by it. I made it OK in my head by telling myself he made a mistake because of all the abuse he suffered as a child and was sorry and ashamed. I swore to myself and to him if he ever did anything like that again I’d do what I had to do to protect my son. It never happened again and he said he was sorry and it was wrong. (He usually just blew him off or bought him things to keep him quiet. He rarely had quality interactions with him.) My son would bring it up to him once in awhile for yrs and when he would, Bad Dad would get agitated with the I’m going to kill somebody look and I would step in and tell my son Dad’s sorry for what he did and he knows it was wrong and he never did it again. I assumed Bad Dad was ashamed and embarrassed and that’s what his reaction was. lol I didn’t realize until he was leaving and I found everything out, that I had been protecting him the same way my mother protected my father.
I know when I watch Bad Dad seduce my son the same way he did me and then turn around and lie to him or blow him off for visits, it drives me nuts because I can’t stop it. I know he hasn’t done the kinds of things some of you talk about to him or even what my father did to me, but the mind games-abuse is abuse.
My ex doesn’t follow the visitation agreement and I haven’t said anything and have made arrangements with him because my son wants to see him. But here we are again waiting to see if he shows up this time because he never confirmed the dates and hasn’t talked to my son in almost a week. It’s all a game and my son is a pawn.
I feel like I’m still teaching my son to tolerate mistreatment, but I’ve been warned he might perceive me as not letting him see his father if I insist on the visitation agreement being followed because we know his father will not follow the rules. He never had any intention of following them. Maybe I’m just making to much out of it. I don’t know. I just want to teach my son what no one taught me.
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righteous woman says:
I used to call the S to come get his son because I wasn’t gonna let him ‘wiggle out’ of his responsibility, his promises, his custody agreement That turned into a whole new type of stress, arguments, waiting..phone calls unreturned, and waiting..did I say waiting?..All this responsibility on me. I gained 50 pounds (after years of skipping meals etc to keep my weight down..hmmmm I wonder why I was so worried about my weight??) developed high-blood pressure and finally diabetes. Finally, I said…It is not anymore my responsibility to make sure my son has a relationship with his father, than it is for my son to have a relationship with anyone in his paternal side of the family. His father is an adult, he knows where his son is…he knows what he promised…I am going to go on about my life..when his father wants to see him, he will arrange it…I shrugged my shoulders, and resisted any and every instinct that wanted to see the two of them have a relationship. I realized, when it came to the Sociopath, that hope was my enemy…it WAS the last thing out of Pandora’s box. I had been suffering from hope about 17 or 18 years at that point. I wasn’t being a good role model to my son, I was letting his father get under my skin, and yes, I reacted in, what is now, very embarrassing ways…embarrassing because A) I was caught in the act and B) I was treated like crap..yet there I was, begging for more??? I was really standing up for myself..refusing to get kicked around like a doormat..but he found other ways to make me feel like Sh!&.
So, it wasn’t so much no contact, as I treated him like anybody else…He was far from special..really no good for our son…So he didn’t call, oh well…so he didn’t take his son anywhere, oh well…I dealt with that by really getting into the character of the person we were dealing with…I explained that every single adult has a responsibility to their child..they either want the relationship, or they don’t, and actions speak louder than words. Pointed out all of the times my son knew I crawled the walls waiting for his dad to show up or whatever, and I said I wasn’t going to do it anymore. And when the S just faded away…and my son broached the subject of his fathers irresponsibility, etc..it opened the door to communication…I could slowly, but surely, show my son the flaws in his fathers character versus what is acceptable by society. And since his father wasn’t visiting, or communicating…it was like falling out of bed…would like not to do it, but it had to be done. You know, I know his father is sick..he has behavioral disorder…and this was discussed with my son. My son also went and took some psychology courses during the summer at the junior college for extra credits for high school (they transfer the credits in the district)..my son gets sociopathy. He is educated, informed, and aware based on facts. His father is incapable of love…and there are several other people in my sons life, and to my sons knowledge, that have been exposed to his father, and that just affirms this assertion. Once I relaxed, and let it be what is was, my son was able to receive information to process and make his own decisions, but, also decisions that are taught based on logic and reason…just like we don’t touch a hot stove…unfortunately..this type of human is no different, HE is IN FACT, a hot stove..He will hurt us.
I bet you anything..If you were calling to firm up these dates…stop…If you want to go do something without the 14-year-old, go..he is old enough to take care of himself. Get him a cell phone, and if his dad comes by or what have you..you want a phone call..no different than if he had tentative plans with school friends….I shrug my shoulders..I make a face like Robert DeNiro thinking something is not worth it. Go on and live your life and encourage your son to do the same.
PS. Righteous woman is for Righteous indignation.
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OxDrover says:
TRyingtorecover, the “memory loss” is a “normal response” to all the stress you have endured. I literally had amnesia on some things. Short term memory loss big time, and I am a registered Nurse Practitioner and I retired because of it (among other things) How could I take care of patients when I couldn’t remember what I had said or done for them?
I couldn’t “organize” myself out of a paper bag. This from a woman that could MULTITASK with the best of them, I got to the point I couldn’t SINGLE TASK. I was distractable like an ADHD kid. Jumping from one thing to another with no idea where I had been.
Dr. Viktor Frankl, who wrote a book called “Man’s search for Meaning” after being in the Nazi concentration camps (talk about stress!) says that “A normal response to an abnormal situation would be abnormal.”
The short term memory and other problems can also be part of the fact that we don’t sleep well either after all this. Our sleep is disterbed, and lack of good and restful sleep will “mess up your thinking” and memory.
The spelling thing is a big problem for me now, and word finding, yet, when I was given an IQ test, I scored in the same range I always have, in fact a point or so higher. Don’t ask me how, but I did. It did reassure me. My psychiatrist also says that my memory will get better as I heal. It is frustrating though at times as the ONE thing I could always count on was my mind!
I would suggest that you sit down with your son, at 14 he is big enough to see what is going on. Explain to him that YOU are NOT trying to keep him from visiting his father, and that you will let HIM (the son) make the arrangements anyway that is convenient for them. I will bet that your son gets tired of the “game” before long and quits calling his Bad Dad when he sees that the Dad doesn’t keep his agreements.
That takes the ball out of YOUR COURT and puts the visitation in HIS court. I would relax the rules completely and let him see your son when ever he wants to (which I bet won’t be much) and I would let the responsibility fall on HIM for keeping his promises to your son—NOT you. I think he is trying to “get to” you and punishing you by not sticking to the agreement. This way–you are not the bad guy any more, and you are not “protecting” your son from the TRUTH about his dad, as painful as that may be.
He may try to secduce your son for a while, but my guess is he will get tired of that if it doesn’t get a rise out of YOU.
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righteous woman says:
OMG!!! Great minds think alike OxDrover!!!
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tryingtorecover says:
Thank you righteous woman and OxDrover. Great advice. I know that I have to let go. I can’t protect him from everything. He needs to be able to protect himself. I love the hot stove metaphor, rw. I didn’t stand guard 24 hrs a day in front of the stove when he was a toddler. I taught him to know that hot stoves will burn. If you put in a simple form like that, it makes so much sense.
I guess the biggest reason I freak out when he’s in town is because I have this vision of Bad Dad getting POd and turning in front of a car so my son gets hit or something like that. He would drive crazy when he couldn’t control his temper and one time I didn’t know if he was going to put me into a tree. Usually they’re short bursts of rage and he gets himself back under control quickly. It would have to be the perfect situation because he can control his temper when he needs to. He’d have to be losing the gf and her money and have no other options for him to totally lose it. (He’d have to feel like he was losing control.) Right now he’s working his game so I don’t think I have to worry about that.
Thank you Ox Dover for sharing your experiences with memory loss. It helps to know other people have gone through the same thing and there’s hope. I’m in the process of finally moving from thinking about him and what happened to thinking about me and living my own life for the first time ever! I can feel the change, but sometimes I can feel myself holding on to thoughts of everything. I think it’s because once I totally let go, the person I thought I married will truly be dead to me. I think actually the real reason is fear of the unknown and having to build a new life from scratch. Scary stuff:) I have to stop hearing his voice in my head and know that I can do this and I will do this.
righteous woman, how did your son react to discovering his father could not love? ( I will never tell him his father doesn’t love him, but someday when he learns more about the PDs he going to know he’s not capable.) My counselor keeps telling me how a child needs to feel loved by their parents. No kidding. But, that’s not the reality. She says love is subjective. She doesn’t like the word. People love pizza. People love their children. It means different things to different people. She says he can’t love like you and I love, but he loves him to the extent he’s capable. But, if he loves him like he would an object, is that love? So confusing. Any thoughts from anyone?
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righteous woman says:
Hi tryingtorecover,
Here is the deal…It is not that my son’s father does not love him. As an object, he simply adores him. My son’s father does not love. Period. He loves himself.
For example: Lets take this in a detached direction, but using the same subject matter…my own, personal sociopath (ie: my son’s father). My sons father has a daughter from another woman. (the woman and I get along great, and when he was living with her, her hair was falling out…get the picture on the short version of the backstory?) The mother had several issues going on, and, the daughter was beginning to suffer from daddy syndrome. So, when the daughter was 14, she went to go live with the S father. Ironically, he moved his daughter into MY old apartment, the one he insisted I give up to move in with him in a different part of town, then, when he and I ‘parted ways’ he got a new girlfriend. Moved the new girlfriend AND his daughter into the same exact apartment I shared with his son, and he had spent MUCH time at…but I digress…ANYHOW, the new girlfriend was 17 years his junior..he was 38, she was 21. He had told the girlfriend that he was 28 when they met..she found out later, from me, and other women she got in contact with that had dealt with him, and all about his various lies. She also saw the way he treated his daughter in general, like she was a piece of property, to be controlled, and he made many unreasonable, self serving requests of her..and the young lady eventually bailed….She, of course was paying the rent on the apartment, She left, he got evicted for non payment of rent, and he moved onto his current victim, a woman that is 6 years older than he is. (I mention her elsewhere in another blog – snapshots…she is now living in her snapshots, despite being cheated on in the house SHE provides for him).
So, he and the new victim have been co-habitating since 2005. Wasn’t sexual at first, but he seduced her…and she has been putty in his hands ever since (despite being cheated on, lied to, him not coming home, him telling her she was fat, unattractive, should get moles cut off of her face etc…You are getting the picture) The daughter has her own room, but she barely comes hom..she knows how he is, the lies are the hardest thing to take, because, when you really know him, you know what a bunch of BS he is laying down 24/7.
So the daughter turns 18 in August, it is October, and she is working, erolled in school, and has an active social life, like any 18-year old. She wasn’t able to walk with her class on graduation day because her dad would not take her to school on time, and her citizenship mark affected her being able to walk.
So the new victim is really being put things, but she won’t have him leave because “he can be such a nice guy”. She has been struggling to communicate with him, and his answer has been encouraged to relay things of concern to him only. He does not want to hear about her day, or her friends, or her family. Those things bore him. And she accepts this, but is struggling to find things to talk to this man about. The NV (new victim) has a daughter in high school with my son. So she tells on my son a few times because she is spying and reporting on my son to the S. What she doesn’t know, is I could care less what the S says to me about what my son is doing. He left it to me to figure out, so I am..He can’t get a rise out of me.
So, the NV daughter, tells her mother, that she thinks that the S daughter is doing drugs, that she lied about the graduation thing and a couple of other allegations that are so retarded that they are not even worth mentioning. The S throws himself into a ‘rage’ (by the way…all rages are real, but they are fake..they are done to assert control, i have a sneaking suspicion your S never got the car t-boned, or drove off a cliff with you or anybody else in the car, and never will, it might hurt HIM get it?), bursts into his daughters room and destroys all the belongings that can be broken or ripped from the walls and smashed….he tells his daughter to get the hell out and she is a liar and he won’t stand for it etc…So the daughter packs some things to leave. She is going to leave the house, and the stairs right out front are wet, she slips and gets big gash in her head and on her arm. The S comes outside, laughs and tells her that is what she gets and he refuses to take her to the hospital, with a head injury!!!
Now, I wasn’t there for this story I heard it related from HER mother and MY son. But the S loves no one. People are only tools, objects, to be utilized, or should I say used. He used his daughter because, I mean this, from talking to the past victim and current victim, that they were both made to feel guilty and concerned for the sake of the daughter…What they knew of her mother, she was a drug addict and a slut (TOTAL LIES) They didn’t know what would happen to the daughter, if they put the S father out…He used his daughter to obtain housing. The girlfriends did all the chauffering, clothes shopping, grocery shopping everything for the S daughter.
Yes, counselors would object to what solution worked for me. Love is love. If you love someone, as you know, they are a priority for you. I have had two best girlfriends since I was 5 and another since I was 12..my sons,sisters, mother and I have been friends for over 10-years now. I am not maintaining these relationships simply because they exist. I put effort into them, I call my friends, take them out to dinner when they are feeling down and had a hard day, a hard month. Our love is reciprocating, and deserved by all parties, and we maintain it. I am a loyal and loving person. You are a loyal and loving person…no one should be encouraged to love someone who takes other people for granted and treats them as objects. As one of my friends always says about my S “Cut him out like a cancer. ” My son accepts that his father can not love…it is not an evilness that is directed AT him by his father. And my son understands this. You need to make your son understand the same thing (after the contact starts to diminish) And please, oh please…do not encourage your son to call to set up dates….His father is responsible for that. If it doesn’t happen on the part of the adult, than it wasn’t meant to be. Children are not responsible for their parents…parents are responsible for their children..Type it out, Blow up the FONT – put it on your bathroom mirror. Live by that…It is not an opinion, it is a natural fact. That is teaching your son good morals so the cycle STOPS with his father…otherwise, you aren’t going to know your grandchildren, and the negative possibilities are endless…I have a duty to make my son into a man and a normal member of society…My son has to live by societies norms, not his own rules, like the S. Isn’t that what you expect of your son?? That is what I expect of YOUR son…do you get where I am coming from? I am saying this to strengthen you…Do not let the S opinions of you cloud your knowledge, …because he has, and will continue to plant the seeds of self doubt as long as you keep providing a nice tilled field.
Ok, I don’t know what else to say…
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righteous woman says:
Hi to all that may come across this blog.
I want to write an amendment/disclaimer to my opinions above.
I fear I sound as if I am advising adversarial behavior. I am not. I was speaking in relation to my experience with an S that used my son to control, to control me, which he actually admitted. He picked my son up to get on my good side. Once he was on my good side, he went back to disregarding his child.
In what I was writing, in no way am I implying that an S parent, that takes an active interest in their child be made to ‘work’ for their visits with their child by having to overcome obstacles to get access to that child. If they show up on time and take an active interest, then it IS to naturally be assumed that perhaps this individual, although self motivated, may have a sincere interest in building a relationship. I fear I was walking the line of parental alienation. Which was not my intent.
If you have a S parent, that wants visitation and shows up on time, returns the child on time, although I think this would be rare (only because I think we are dealing with the same patterns generally) Then, this relationship should be allowed to unfold.
If you have a parent that is showing up, without being dragged or coerced, but refuses to put your child’s best interest at heart by returning the child on time (Mine used to bring our son home between 11pm to 2:00 in the morning on school nights), then the solution is to document these occurances, keep a journal. If they do not show up on time, or within a window of acceptable wait time, then go on about your business. But write it in the journal. If the S shows up 1 hour late (or MORE) and you are not there, waiting to hand over their child, with the blame game, they will say that YOU are making things difficult for THEM. This is why you need your journal…to document THEIR pattern of behavior.
And NONE of us want to have to go to court. NONE of us want to talk to a mediator. But some S are legal savvy to use the legal system to provoke us. (Mine isn’t like that, but yours may be). You want to document his lack of respecting the agreement, so a judge or mediator can SEE the pattern of behavior. You want to project that you are not being arbitrary..that the S is. Trust me…you will NOT have to take THEM to court to MAKE THEM visit their child on time.
Now, the older the child gets, the easier this gets. In most states, the age of 14 is the magic age that children’s desires are appreciated by the court. The child choosing whom they want to live with, and how often they want to visit the other parent is given greater appreciation.
Finally, when discussing the S parent with the child, it should be broached on the same conditions in which you discuss sex. If they are old enough to ask, they are at an age to receive information. They may not understand, but they can ask for clarification later when they have had time to think about it and request an expansion on your knowledge. And like discussing sex, always make sure it is age appropriate. You can’t discuss with a 5 year old, what you can discuss with your teenager.
The normal custody sharing agreement has two involved parents, working as a team for the child’s benefit. My S could fake this, or faked it from me ‘coaching’ him. When the child is younger, and the S doesn’t show up on time, and, in time, you see the behavior from your child (may possible be learned behavior)..you don’t berate the S, you explain that common decency and courtesy for other demands that you honor your commitments and have respect for all people involved. It is rude and inconsiderate to leave someone waiting. You can reflect on your own experiences, leaving the S out…So if the child offers this observation “Daddy’s/mommy’s always late” The answer is “yes..he/she is, and don’t we hate what it does to our day?” Berating the other parent is NEVER a good idea.
We are not teaching our children to hate, or disrespect someone that deserves respect. We can all teach our children right from wrong without disparaging their other parent. If that other parent disparages themselves, and your children see that this is behavior contrary to what you have taught, the other parent manages to alienate themselves. You don’t have to take any initiative at all.
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Mrose says:
I know this is an older post but, I did want to comment on it. Aside from depression that was so bad I became suicidal for a while. I also have PTSD now which is somewhat better after six months but, it’s still something to deal with. The biggest physical symptom I had though was that my thyroid totally shut down from STRESS. My doctor confirmed that this is what caused my thyroid to completely shut down. I lost a ton of weight suddenly and my hair was falling out like crazy, and I was so exhausted I could barely get through a couple of hours of work. Now because the sociopath had me so upset all the time I didn’t attribute my symptoms to something physical until my doctor decided to do a blood test when I complained of extreme fatigue.
I’m now on meds for the rest of my life and after a year they still haven’t got the doseage of the synthroid quite right but, it’s certainly better than it was.
So, depression *I am on celexa*, PTSD, and a non functioning thyroid.
The damage these people do is really not to be under estimated. I’m still going to be pulling myself out of this financial mess for years to come but, that’s the least of it over all. My son’s health and mine have both suffered. Meanwhile, as it goes with sociopaths he claims I am the bad guy while he waltzes off without a so much as a scratch or symptom at all. In fact he’s better off by far than when we met and I’m totally wiped out.
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Buttons says:
Yes, indeed, there is a physical consequence to exposure to a sociopath! I was married to one for nearly 15 years and was constantly sick, infected, falling, and sustaining haphazard injuries.
My personal belief is that the body must manifest whatever stress our emotions are experiencing. For me, the relationship was so abusive that my body released the level of stress in physical form.
Once I got out of the immediate environment and left him, I began to experience an incredible boost in health. I stopped getting sick all of the time and suffering injuries that were not abuser/victim related.
Does the sociopath experience physical consequences? I believe that they do, even if they aren’t immediately visible. My ex dropped dead of a massive heart attack at 50. Again, since the mind-body connection is so strong, that evil (and, that’s what I have to call it) has to manifest itself, somehow. If the sociopath isn’t sick all the time, themselves, then I believe that they are (like my ex) a ticking bomb. It takes an enormous amount of energy for a human being to live the way that sociopaths do. Rather than that energy being used for self-healing, it’s used to machinate and fabricate, thus leaving the sociopath with no healing reserves.
Just my take on it.
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one_step_at_a_time says:
button – i think it would take NORMAL people a huge amount of energy to live a deceitful life being horrid to people, spaths, not so much.
if they don’t expereince remorse and guilt or fear in a normal way – then they are not going to release the chemicals that are part of the stress response, and which, when released in large quantities over time, cause stress related illnesses.
don’t know, but that your spath dropping dead @50 may have more to do with untreated high cholesteral, etc. it was also just very very lucky.
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blueskies says:
Buttons you said “Does the sociopath experience physical consequences? I believe that they do, even if they aren’t immediately visible. My ex dropped dead of a massive heart attack at 50. Again, since the mind-body connection is so strong, that evil (and, that’s what I have to call it) has to manifest itself, somehow. If the sociopath isn’t sick all the time, themselves, then I believe that they are (like my ex) a ticking bomb. It takes an enormous amount of energy for a human being to live the way that sociopaths do. Rather than that energy being used for self-healing, it’s used to machinate and fabricate, thus leaving the sociopath with no healing reserves.”
well you’d think so.
I have marvelled(not the right word) at surely the effort the shit they spin takes…
But.. I am thinking from a ‘human’ not sociopathic perspective…
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OxDrover says:
Dear Button, thanks for bringing this old thread up. I enjoyed reading some of the old posts.
I think I read somewhere that P’s have statistically shorter life spans than non-Ps but I don’t imagine it is by much (a few years across the board)
I agree with One-step on this one that the guy dying at 50 of a massive heart attack means he probably also got an early “death gene” from his ancestors. A great deal of our longevity is determined by our genetics as it is.
It behoves us though to take care of ourselves, and many Ps, just like the rest of us, don’t do as much as we should to take care of ourselves. Taking care of ourselves, decreasing our self imposed stress and doing healthy things for ourselves is what we should focus on so that not only the length but the quality of our lives is improved.
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bluejay says:
Life with my h-spath was extremely stressful due to all the chaos that he brought into our lives. I never slept well, tossing and turning all night long, being unable to control my thought processes during the night time hours, everything seeming bleak in my life. Now that we’re living apart, I am going through different stages, still having anxiety. My h-spath would sleep like a baby, none of the constant problems (that he created) disturbing him enough to affect his sleep. It was hell on earth, living on an emotional roller-coaster. Life is some what better due to being apart, being away from the chaos maker.
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