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LETTER TO LOVEFRAUD: I’m at a loss about what to do (Part 2)

Lovefraud received the following letter from a reader who posts as “WalkingInLight.” Read Part 1 here.

Towards the end of our separation a man rang me from S’s church to see if he could help S and I get back together. He told me he had spoken to S and was now speaking to me to see if he could help. I told him I still loved S but really believed he did not love me. This man said he would talk to S the next time he saw him.

Now I have to say that I had not been going to this man’s church for a couple of years because the teaching had taken a ‘strange turn,’ so I was at a different church to my husband. Even though my husband agreed about the teaching, he said he couldn’t leave that church because he respected the leadership and felt loyal to them. As soon as this man told me he was going to speak to S the next time he saw him I KNEW that S would leave that church (so that conversation wouldn’t happen) – and that is exactly what happened. Though S always tells people he left due to the teaching.

I could handle it

But once again, I started to forget all the unpleasantness, and wanted him back again (this sounds mad I know). But i felt that after not knowing what was going on in my marriage for the first 12 years, now that I did know I could handle it. I also found out he was planning to move back to his home country (which he denied) and I knew if he went the girls wouldn’t see him again.

He had up to that point made sure to see them loads and never messed them around, in fact, his relationship with them had never been so good. I went to see him and said I wanted to give it another try. He said he would do it for the sake of the children, but he was moving back home (as I knew) and we would be living there.

He also said I had to cut all ties with my friend. This I agreed to first of all, then said no I wouldn’t do that. He said I shouldn’t go back on my word and tried to bully me in to agreeing.

We spent that Christmas together in the house I was in with the kids. It was odd. He was on his phone texting most of the time, even though he’d said he loved me and wanted the marriage to work, not just for the sake of the children.

Moved to his country

We finally moved. My parents were devastated, because they used to see us all the time, but I was convinced they would come and live with us at some point. We moved to a VERY remote place, for a while I liked it. But after 2 years I realized I didn’t. I was so homesick. I asked him to go back. I begged him to go back. He said, “You can go back if you want.” Even though his family were an hour and half away we very rarely saw them.

His behaviour got a bit better over the years. He seemed less angry in general, but would still react if he felt “threatened” (asking something of him, etc.). He very rarely punched or kicked anything. He stopped smoking drugs. He became more huggy. But the cycle was still there.

He was still saying I was mental and a liar. I BEGGED him to stop saying these things and I really wanted him to admit I was not mental, even though he’d said it to me so much I used to ask my friend, “Am I mental?” She used to say to me, “It worries me that you have to even ask that.” I realized now his games and his countering, denying etc., but it still hurt.

Wanted a son

He wanted a son. I wasn’t sure, because I was 38 years old. He put a picture on my screen saver of a pregnant tummy with a little foot sticking out. I thought it was quiet sweet. I did get pregnant. Then I remembered that he’d always had this fascination with the Bible story of Jacob (I think) who put his sheep in front of the speckled sticks to make them spotty (I think that’s right). He believed in this principle. I asked him if he’d done that with the picture of the pregnant tummy on my screen saver, he just laughed.

We had a son. I had to stay in hospital for a week in the city where his parents lived. He barely came to see me for an hour a day, and because this hospital was so far from our home hardly anyone came to see me. He told me he was looking after the girls at his parents. I later found out he was just out visiting friends.

Awhile after he went to a school reunion, when I saw photos of him on facebook with his old friends I had to do a double take. He was really laughing, relaxed and looked totally different. He looked like a stranger to me; he never looked like that around us.

Boxing

I was really worried about having a son because I didn’t want him to be like S. I knew S would influence him. S had always had this love of boxing, but I had said if we have a son I don’t want him to do boxing. So one night when our son was about 3, S says he is going to help out at the boxing club. I spoke to him and reminded him how I felt about it. He said it wouldn’t affect our son M.

But I knew he would influence him and before you know it M would be boxing. He would make M want to do it. I was so upset. This didn’t just affect me now; this affected my children.

I very calmly tried to talk to him about it, but he used all the usual tricks of diversion, twisting to tie me up in knots. I kept thinking of different ways of saying what I felt, hoping he would understand me this time. But I’d fallen back into the trap of thinking we were having a relationship built on mutuality, where people want to understand each other and sort the problem out. I eventually reminded him of the verse about not doing something you want to do if you know someone else will be upset by it, because then you are not “acting in love.” I really thought he would see my point, but no, he accused me of “manipulating scripture.” I eventually went to see our pastor about the boxing situation. I also told him about our marriage.

Apology

Around this time we had more counseling. I totally opened up about how I really felt in our relationship. I told him I felt totally rejected. He said he would do anything to make me feel secure. A few weeks later we went on a family outing with his parents and brother, sister-in-law and kids. Ten minutes into the walk I turn around from looking at something with the children and he was nowhere to be seen. He’d walked off with his parent.

I spent the rest of the time (at the zoo) walking round without him.

When we met up at the end he said he couldn’t find me. It was a circular walk, which we’d done many times before, but all of a sudden it was too complicated for him to work out where I was. When we got back I told him I couldn’t believe he’d done that after I told him how rejected I felt. He refused to understand or apologize for how that made me feel. I could not move passed this, not after all I’d told him. I needed him to acknowledge it.

I kept trying a couple of times a week to say it in a different way, so the the penny would finally drop and he would see my pain. This went on for 6 months. I was the lowest I’ve ever felt; I wanted to die. After 6 months he said if it means so much to you I’m sorry.

Amiable

More recently he was checking out a beautiful young lady waiting by the school gates with us, really staring at her, right in front of me! I was devastated and embarrassed; we live in a very small community and people must have seen him doing it. I challenged him about it when we got home and of course he denied it. I went to our pastor again. When I got back S said to me that he DIDN’T look at THAT woman but he has been looking at a lot of women and it’s become a habit and he’d been watching a lot of porn as well.

If you met my husband you would think, “What a lovely, intelligent, helpful guy.” He is involved in a lot of community work and has run for local council, representing his political party. In fact, he took a personality test the other day and told us it came back as “amiable,” which he even laughed at. My eldest daughter (who sees what is going on) said, “well you are … to other people.”

No trust

I am going to finish now. Just to say, I thought about a year ago, if I just accepted this as “It is what it is,” and know that he reacts in this way in certain situations (most of which I go out of my way to avoid), I can get on with it.

But there is no intimacy. There is no trust, so many times he uses things I have told him in my weaker moments against me. In times when everything is “ok,” which are quite a lot of the time, I feel nothing for him. We don’t really have a relationship. It is not that I haven’t forgiven him; it is that I can’t trust him.

I know everything may look o.k. on the surface, but that surface only needs to be “scratched” and all this nastiness will spew out.

Something came up the other day. He abused me in front of his brother. (He always does this in front of his family, unless I remind him not to do it before we go. Then he will say “I never do that,” but at least he wont do it.) I spoke to him about it and he said all the usual things to me: “ I am spoilt,” “never take responsibility for my actions,” “never apologize,” “I’m a liar,” etc.

I said to him, you called me a “fat bitch” on Monday and you only just said sorry for that now and it’s Sunday night. And that’s because I said I wanted to talk things over with you. I think if anyone has a lack of responsibility that would be you. I thought to myself, this person DOES NOT KNOW ME AT ALL, AND DOES NOT WANT TO GET TO KNOW ME.

Doesn’t want to change

He wants to stay in his perception of who I am so he doesn’t have to change his behaviour. I have tried in the past to live my own life while living with him but it is very depressing and lonely (more lonely than being alone) and so I fall back into a “relationship” with him.

I am truly at a loss about what to do. I really don’t want to upset my kids, my youngest two would be very upset if the family were to break up. I also don’t know if I’m strong enough to do it either, or whether I’m too old at 44 to start again. Any thought on this would be very helpful.

I apologize again for the length and I thank you if you have managed to read all this.

Love,

WalkingInLight

 



64 Comments on "LETTER TO LOVEFRAUD: I’m at a loss about what to do (Part 2)"

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  1. kaya48 says:

    I also have terrible dreams where my soon to be ex is back in my life. He also was telling me for 20 years that I am “crazy”. I almost believed him and he even asked me to go and get anti depressants prescribed for my “mental illness”. Luckily my physician said that I am completely fine and he would not give me any medications. He offered to see my husband though and prescribe something for him. With my husband being a cop it was very difficult. One night when I exposed his lies and affairs he called one of his deputy friends and told him that I was trying to kill myself. What was a blatant lie. Of course in this state they “baker act ” you and send you to a mental evaluation. I was released after 2 hours because the psychiatrist said I was totally “set up” by my husband. It was a complete shock that a person who claimed to love me for 20 years would go to such an extreme to make me believe I am crazy. I am recovering now and hope to be divorced before the end of this year. I am sure the dreams will get less with time. He has new narcissistic supply now. I am glad she took my place 🙂



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    • Jan7 says:

      Hi Kaya, I have had the same type dreams 🙁

      I have often wondered why during the last few years of my marriage my dreams were so vivid…I wondered if it had to do with adrenal gland issues such as high cortisol and adrenaline levels plus hormonal imbalance due to the stress..Mia lundin says yes see her video on you tube about sleep issues related to hormonal imbalance (hormones can get unbalanced do to stress). I just googled “vivid dremas physical issues” and this was posted, thought it was interesting:

      Causes of Vivid Dreams
      Major Life Changes
      Situations that have a high psychological impact on a person can increase your chances of increased vivid dreaming. This is your body’s way of helping to manage the stress and intense feelings. Big events such as changing jobs, moving, getting pregnant, getting married or losing a loved one will frequently cause vivid dreaming. If you are not prone to this condition, think about events in your life that could be triggering these effects.

      Dietary
      Eating spicy foods has been linked to patients developing nightmares. Eating pizza or Stilton cheeses before bed has also been shown to cause people to experience dreams that are very erratic or strange. Taking certain supplements has also been found to increase dream activity. For example, vitamin B6 has been shown to increase dream activity in those using this supplement regularly. These foods can lead to vivid dreaming, especially if paired with other vivid dreaming techniques.

      Low Blood Sugar
      Having low blood pressure before you go to bed can cause vivid dreaming. As the nervous system notes that your blood sugar is low it will produce adrenaline to help balance your system. High levels of adrenaline in your system will be expressed through your dreams. If you have been experiencing excessive or vivid dreams that are undesirable, try eating a light, high protein snack before bed. Do not eat foods that are hard to digest as this can lead to other health issues.

      Medications Effects
      Certain medications list vivid dreaming as a side effect. This is a common effect of using anti-depressants. Herbs such as chamomile and valerian are often used to increase sleep, but they can also increase your chances of experiencing vivid dreaming. Some herbs such as calea zacatechichi have been used in the ritual practice of vivid dreaming in many cultures. Taking a combination of medications and supplements may also increase your chances of developing lucid dreaming effects.

      Mind Training
      Mediation has been known to help individuals become more aware of their surroundings. This can increase your ability to realize you are in a dream state so that you can begin to control your dream environment. Meditation has also been shown to help people remember their dreams more effectively, making it easier to analyze dream themes and elements. Some mind training techniques have also been shown to be effective in causing a lucid dreaming state. Telling yourself that you are going to have a vivid dream before you go to bed can cause you to experience this phenomenon.

      Take Control of Vivid Dreams
      Change Sleep Cycle
      Altering your sleep cycle can often help you increase or decrease your vivid dreaming experiences as necessary. Experimenting with falling asleep and waking up at different times as well as getting different amounts of sleep at night can help you get the dreaming experience that is right for you.

      Use Techniques Consistently
      It is important to remember that any techniques you attempt to use to cause vivid dreaming must be used consistently. Your body will need to get used to the effects before it will have a drastic effect on your psychological state.

      Stop Side-effected Techniques
      Every person’s brain chemistry is different and will react to different stimuli. Work with a variety of techniques to find the one that works best for you. Do not continue to use any techniques that are causing you physical distress or may contribute to other health concerns in your life



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      • kaya48 says:

        Thanks jan7 for this helpful article concerning sleep patterns. The last few years with him were tough and I had vivid dreams almost nightly. In some of the dreams there was always another woman. Ironically most of the dreams became true. During that time my soon to be ex was “extra” mean to me, hiding, lying and cheating every day. Sometimes he twisted my words in a way that I honestly thought I was going “crazy”. It is very interesting to read how this stress can cause those dreams. I am dealing with a nasty divorce right now. He still manipulates and controls. I am not sure if that works with my attorney though. There is no contact since 5 months. I wish I would have found this website the day he left. I would have never responded to his worthless stuff that came out of his mouth. I learned though that by me ignoring him 100 percent, I am in control now. Thanks for all the good advice.



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        • Jan7 says:

          Hi Kaya, our stories are almost the same. I was just pondering how many generations of women have suffered at the hands of these types of men. I went to marriage counseling with him and right when the first counselor knew what type of guy he really was (his mask was slipping for her to see the truth and from what I told her) he told me not to trust her and of course being so brain washed I did what he said, soon after we stopped going to her at his demand, I wish she would have told me the truth as I was so desperate for help, I had no know idea about narcissism/sociopath, I just knew he was not normal.

          I equate my marriage to living in hell and divorcing him the bottom of hell. He was able to manipulate everyone in the court house…I actually saw how he easily he manipulated people during that phase, how I was manipulated into dating/marrying him when I had zero interest in him or a future with him. I saw that he could trance/hypnosis people as crazy as that sound…everyone that dealt with him would say the same thing after he did these things to them, being told by a counselor when I first left that sociopaths trance/hypnosis it was quite shocking to actually see him doing this to people, throughout my marriage I felt he was doing these things to me but I knew nothing of trance/hypnosis. Just glad I escaped, I feel sorry for all of his future victims.

          As soon as I learned about the no contact rule I followed it too…I know he hated that becuase he would email me none stop with ranting emails when I left him…I stopped reading them and that help alot to with my stress level and the brain washing he had control over my mind started to slip away so that I could think on my own. The wierd thing is I knew within a min when he had emailed me, like I sensed him writting it..so crazy.

          I am glad you found this site too…huge blessing for all of us, I wish you nothing but the best dealing with your divorce and your future.



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          • Jan7 says:

            ps the twisting of words he did to you is gas lighting abuse. He was changing your prespective of what you remember…this type of abuse makes some feel they are going crazy but they are not…very scary though. My ex did this all day long.

          • kaya48 says:

            Yes indeed our stories seem the same. We also went to arrogate counseling but he decided the counselor was a crazy b….., who had no education. Do he would not go anymore. I was also brainwashed to believe him. After he left and discarded me I went back to counseling by myself. She did confirm that he is a narcissist and never once felt sorry for the pain he caused his family. To this day he blames me for everything. What you wrote about the divorce being the bottom of hell is scary . I have no other choice but divorcibg him. I filed July 08 but finally it’s progressing now with motions after motions.

          • Jan7 says:

            I put everything in motions but he did none of the things list even though the Judge granted the motions and forced him to follow the motions he still did not comply…for me the motions were just a waste of money/time…lawyers love cases like ours because they know that they abuser will do nothing and they will make lots of $$$ while we emotionally suffer by still having to deal with our abusers trying to control us.

            I left my husband and filed for divorce but he made the divorce the bottom of hell because he did not want to let go of me despite him having three mistresses when I left him. The good news once the divorce is done life gets much better.

            I think it is unethical for the counselor to wait till you go to individual counseling before they tell you the truth, just my opinion, I stayed another 6 or 7 years after our brief marriage counseling sessions because i did not have answers to his behavior, had she told me I would have immediately ended my marriage. When I left my husband he started a smear campaign with lie after lie to the point I lost all our couple friends because they believed his lies, I have read this is very common when dealing with a sociopath as they are so fearful of everyone piecing all his craziness together…someday they will too know he is a liar…hopefully sooner then later.

            Have you checked out facebook page One moms battle? it is a page for women divorcing a narcissist. it’s a very good pg. If you dont have a fb pg you can still read the site just by googling “one moms battle facebook”

  2. Linette says:

    Kaya so sorry you are going through this. My first was a cop. I should have seen his anger while we were dating but I mistook it as “strength”. It didn’t take long to see the truth after we got married. But then I was afraid and brainwashed into thinking it was supposed to be that way. There are many good police officers but unfortunately there are some that go into it because of the power and control that comes with it. I still dream about him and I have been away from him for 13 years. The last one wasn’t a police officer but very power hungry. In his case he love-bombed and was a completely different person before we married. They are so good at what they do.



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  3. kaya48 says:

    Linette,
    Thank you for your encouraging comments. You mentioned “strength”. I also looked at his anger as it being strength. He was 21 years active duty army before he became a cop. Do yes he was after the “being in power jobs”. When I caught him exchanging nude photos with with a young female deputy taken during their nightshifts, I was completely in shock. I first thought of a “midlife crisis” but then I realized with the help of a marriage counselor that he was and always will be a narcissist. By the way the 20 something co worker is now his new supply. He is almost 50 years old. And he wonders why his 19 year old son lost all respect for him. And yes I agree there are good, honest deputies out there. He is just a “dirty cop” who wastes tax payers money with his porn and sex addiction. Actually it is very sad someone like him is a public figure. If it wasn’t for my alimony claim in the divorce I would turn all pictures in to internal affairs and have them both fired. But now money is more important then me getting revenge. It would not benefit me in any way.



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  4. kaya48 says:

    Jan7
    Sorry for all the spelling mistakes. I was unable to edit it . Well sorry to hear that your divorce was the bottom of hell. I am truly afraid that this where I am heading. He claims everything is his and that he is poor. I am thankful there are no minor children involved. Yes indeed the marriage counseling was a waste of time for me. He continued his affairs while in counseling . It is still unbelievable for me how a human being can have absolutely no remorse, empathy or emotions. How coldly he was able to say ” I don’t love you anymore “. I made the best choice by filing. Often I still think how could I let someone disrespect me like this? Jan 7 I appreciate all your advice about the divorce. Yes he probably will ignore all the motions, you are right. And they are expensive . He is hiding pension plans etc. so my attorney had to file them. I think his time will come when he has to own up to his evilness. He lost the love of his son already.



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    • Jan7 says:

      Hi Kaya, the good news as you get space when the divorce is final life gets better, much more calmer and peaceful..that is priceless.

      your soon to be ex has lost his wife and son. He is not a happy man and that is why he keeps chasing all his addictions eventually he will be a lonely old man who will most likely have been married and divorced several times.

      You did the right thing by divorcing him.

      ps I did not notice sp errors…I forgot to sp check too 🙂



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  5. kaya48 says:

    Thanks jan7, reading this gives me a lot of hope and strength. And you are right, he probably is not a happy man. His father did the exact same at around the same age. After numerous affairs and abusing his wife he left her with 5 children. He used the same “I don’t love you anymore .” Left her on their anniversary because she became old, sexual boring, hair too short and overweight. Ironically my husband was never able to forgive his father and cut of all contact with him about 20 years ago. When I asked him about it, he would say “how could I ever respect him again after what he did to my mother.” So now he became his own father. Someone he never wanted to be like. And yes his father is on his 4th wife now, he is physically ill, not handsome anymore and very poor. Funny how you mentioned this. I know this behavior that went on throughout many generations will stop right here . I know for a fact that my 19 year old son is nothing like them. Thanks again jan 7 . I truly believe in what you are saying 🙂



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